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  1. #26
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    Obama got 96% of the black voted in 2008, so getting 95% of the black vote in 2012 is no improvement. The poll was flawed to begin with. “The numbers came from a statistically significant sample of more than 100 African-American voters out of 1,000 total voters in the poll,”. So the media pumps up the results of a sampling that includes 100 African-american voters out of a population of 42 million. Seems a far stretch of statistics to extrapolate those polls results to the whole population of African-Americans.

    More BS meant to incite, divide and inflame!

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    Thats a valid point. Im all for if we're gonna talk about it, lets talk about all sides of it.

    I would ask now though, do we think the numbers that voted based solely on race will vote differently now because of what changes have or have not comeforth, or are they going to stick to the race card, be it for or against?
    Again I dont feel this is the race card...

    My view is that the majority of Americans no matter the culture are not fully versed in politics, not as much as they should be versed or think they are. That being said if Herman Cain were the presumptive nominee he wouldn't getting the support of the community simply because he is a Republican not because of his skin color. Not in the numbers as a Democrat... Now again I will happily concede that Obama got more of the vote than prior Dems and that skin color played a part. I think the reason why from the voting side differs from what White America wants to believe. Obama got more support because people in the community could relate to him and thats important for any candidate. He looks like them, has their experiences both good and bad and speaks to them. Not at them. Thats important to note

    Voters vote for people with whom they relate to and feel some kind of oneness with. Along with their views etc.... Did some folks say simply based on skin color I am going for him? Yes But that happened on both sides of the coin both White and Blacks did so. There is no denying the historical precedent being set during that election. I think folks got wrapped up in that and with both Houses proving to be useless there's some buyers remorse
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  3. #28
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mramg1 Click here to enlarge
    PS: I would vote for a green women if she could fix the economy, LOL
    I think this one can:

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  4. #29
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by yage202 Click here to enlarge
    Obama got 96% of the black voted in 2008, so getting 95% of the black vote in 2012 is no improvement. The poll was flawed to begin with. “The numbers came from a statistically significant sample of more than 100 African-American voters out of 1,000 total voters in the poll,”. So the media pumps up the results of a sampling that includes 100 African-american voters out of a population of 42 million. Seems a far stretch of statistics to extrapolate those polls results to the whole population of African-Americans.

    More BS meant to incite, divide and inflame!
    The poll shows that one group is more inclined to vote based on someone simply having similar appearance. I think that does highlight an aspect of racism political correctness in this country ignores.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    2. Class and race go hand in hand... The higher up in the economic class you go the less minorities you find. Thats a direct result of the struggles faced by the respective cultures. Whether it be education, job opportunities or what have you. When you get into the upper middle class and upper class communities. The cultural landscape starts to become a lesser spectrum than when you go into the lower middle class and below communities. Thats a fact here in the US. Folks can argue all day over why but the stats dont lie on the matter.
    This is always the excuse used and I'm sick of it.

    My father was is what you would term "white" even though I disagree with that as lumping all white people together makes about as much sense as saying every Latin person is Mexican.

    Struggles are up to you to overcome. I don't see my father complaining about getting sent to a concentration camp by Stalin. He didn't sit around crying about all the people in the upper class. He made something of himself instead of sitting around complaining that things aren't equal. And that had NOTHING to do with skin color.

    The stats show that there are more successful white people than black people. That doesn't mean black people can't be successful.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    You see a black man in a Ferrari then he must be an athlete or entertainer, maybe into something illegal like drugs
    This is a stereotype promoted by Black people themselves. Kanye raps about dropping out of college and how much money has. This is what that culture promotes. Great role model and I don't see any prominent black individuals (other than Bill Cosby who gets ridiculed for it) speaking out about it. Instead the hip-hop culture is embraced.

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  6. #31
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    You sir need an education... I have yet to understand how an african american cannot be whatever he wants in this country or how a white person has the advantage. Sure, there is a class issue here but that applies to all races and has nothing to do with racial inequality. You say there are standouts in the african american community, sure... just as there are standouts in the white community. Jay-z owns a part of the brooklyn nets, trump is a boss as well. Not everyone can be like these individuals, the fact that there is more people in the middle class that are white is directly related to hard work and not racial barriers. I know African american doctors, lawyers, dentists and business executives just as I know poor white rednecks... I do not see the point of this discussion.

    You also just pretty much said Obama isnt black enough an that Kanye West has never said anything racist lol... I am done arguing here.
    Ok gloves off then....

    You changed my statement on a simple fact to something totally outside of what I said. You went from Obama factually being HALF WHITE AND HALF BLACK to he's not black enough? Thats in and of itself spells stupid on your part. But riddle me this, what is black enough? Better yet does that make him not white enough as well? Now how dumb does that sound... And what did Kanye say that was racist? The Bush comment, cause that aint it... The Taylor Swift thing, lets be honest she's not that talented but how is that racist? (Hell she owes him some money she blew up after that whole thing, but thats another conversation) Again drop me something to back that up the Kanye is a racist thing. Now if you said Kanye was an idiot, arrogant and a less than skilled MC I'd be with you, racist however I dont see.

    Your second statement states that whites in the middle class worked hard to get there. Thus are you implying that blacks dont work hard? If you want to stay on subject lets do that, but jumping around and changing my statements wont fly. Get some facts and come back again. Having to work harder to achieve the same goal or to be perceived in the same light is not equal. That's the core of the issue in this community, perhaps your community has different issues but do not lessen or belittle what you dont understand or know. That is the epitome of ignorance
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  7. #32
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    This is always the excuse used and I'm sick of it.

    My father was is what you would term "white" even though I disagree with that as lumping all white people together makes about as much sense as saying every Latin person is Mexican.

    Struggles are up to you to overcome. I don't see my father complaining about getting sent to a concentration camp by Stalin. He didn't sit around crying about all the people in the upper class. He made something of himself instead of sitting around complaining that things aren't equal. And that had NOTHING to do with skin color.

    The stats show that there are more successful white people than black people. That doesn't mean black people can't be successful.



    This is a stereotype promoted by Black people themselves. Kanye raps about dropping out of college and how much money has. This is what that culture promotes. Great role model and I don't see any prominent black individuals (other than Bill Cosby who gets ridiculed for it) speaking out about it. Instead the hip-hop culture is embraced.
    I dont see where I made any excuses and I cant imagine what your father lived though. It's good to hear he made his way and gave you a chance for a good life in the process and frankly the whole point in life. In stating white I am covering a broad swath of people and I respect your point. By saying black I am doing the same as well, thats not to generalize anyone on either side and I am careful in trying not to do so.

    You're father could complain and it would be a valid one, someone took your culture and killed, imprisoned and maimed them based on bias. Its heinous to say the least, it sounds like instead your father put his head down and got to work. Thats what many people do and they should. I couldnt agree more, action gets results. Nobody is crying about not being equal, I'm highlighting the obvious here no more no less. Dont mistake a statement or post for a manner by which I function.

    As for Kanye, music is entertainment in my view and just like the movies. Its not all real and while he may rap about dropping out he is by no mean glorifying it or saying people should follow in his footsteps. If someone were to make that choice odds are in favor they got bigger issues if a song influences their life decisions...
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  8. #33
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    lol... i am with sticky on this one and i rarely agree with him. Its funny how Bill Cosby consistently gets made fun out when he is the only one to tell the truth and frankly this is why balcks domt like him either. You want to know something else, he grew up in a Ghetto in Philly and has a PHD while being a Millionaire. No one glorifies him... its a funny world.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    You're father could complain and it would be a valid one, someone took your culture and killed, imprisoned and maimed them based on bias.
    Yes, he could have complained and he has far more reason to complain than black people in this country in this day and age. Slavery ended almost two centuries ago. No African American children are being denied any opportunity or having their families lives ruined and being deported to some isolated area.

    Rather than sitting around saying things aren't fair and pointing fingers he did something crazy. He educated himself and worked. Nobody is stopping any minority from doing the same.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    Its not all real and while he may rap about dropping out he is by no mean glorifying it or saying people should follow in his footsteps.
    He titled his album College Dropout and you want to make this point?

    For whatever reason black culture promotes hip-hop, sports, and drugs as the way to make money instead of the old fashioned education and hard work approach. I think some fingers need to be pointed inwardly.

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  10. #35
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    lol... i am with sticky on this one and i rarely agree with him. Its funny how Bill Cosby consistently gets made fun out when he is the only one to tell the truth and frankly this is why balcks domt like him either. You want to know something else, he grew up in a Ghetto in Philly and has a PHD while being a Millionaire. No one glorifies him... its a funny world.
    But this IS glorified:

    Click here to enlarge

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  11. #36
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Great minds think alike Sticky, LOL

    Do you know the episodes name?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
    Ha! Well, partially retired...and the state of the economy has direct implications on my investments which managing is a full time job.

    I'm not too thrilled with Obama either, I just can't stand Romney - he is the quintessential republican and I know he'd $#@! this country up worse than it already is.

    One mayor policy change I know could immediately and drastically reduce our deficit - pull all troops out of the middle east and close all bases there and never go back. Bring 'em all back home and have them build a 50ft wall along the boarder with Mexico.

    I hear ya.

    RE: Pulling out all troops from the Middle Eastern part of the world, I think it sounds good in theory but in reality (IMO) it would cause a lot of instability in the region.

  13. #38
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mramg1 Click here to enlarge
    Great minds think alike Sticky, LOL

    Do you know the episodes name?
    One of the episodes of Star Trek Enterprise, I'll have to look.

    Found it. It's titled Bound.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    My response would be as follows...

    1. Racist would by definition imply that the community believes they are superior. That's a rare sentiment in this community.

    2. The majority of Black Americans are Democrats while a smaller percentage at are Republican. To say zero support is an exaggeration but it's certainly small. Comparable to past GOP candidate support levels I suspect.

    Romney struggles within his own party he is not totally embraced its more of a "well we got him so push it till falls off" kind of thing. He could very well win if he can carry a few key states. Dont sleep he has money and a charged up GOP on his back
    Good points.

    RE: point #1, I think this topic would be a good point for debate. I wasn't even thinking about racism in terms of one race feeling superior over another race. But, obviously, it makes sense what you said. In the classic sense -- in the U.S. -- the most obvious group of racists would be White supremacists. Just doing a quick Wikipedia search turned up an explanation of the term Supremacism; that's where one race or group feels superior over another race.

    I then looked up the term "racism" on a dictionary website and found 3 definitions. The first one mentioned the doctrine of superiority. But, the third one was more in line with my current understanding of the word: "hatred or intolerance of another race or races."

    RE: the point about the decline of Black GOP voters. This is another very interesting point. If in fact their is zero support for Romney (which, like you said, does seem unlikely... but it could be close). 11% for Bush in 2004 and 4% for McCain in 2008. Now, it's expected to be close to zero in 2012. I can see why republicans (no matter the race) were not thrilled with McCain... He wasn't a true conservative. So, that alone could account for some of the decreased Black GOP support. But, it remains to be seen what the reasons are for the continued decline of Black GOP support.

    I don't see how Romney can win. Especially, if a super majority of Black voters don't vote for him. And if the Latino vote is 2:1 for Obama, then there is just too much ground to make up. The problem with the GOP is they can't figure out what they represent anymore. It's been that way for some time.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
    It would cost a ton of money to pull out and create security issues... A drawdown is certainly needed but how much and how fast is a big debate with no right answer and there are many ways to a solution. Bigger still is once these men & women return, in particular our reservist. Many will be out of work and only adding to the unemployment picture. These wars have gone over multiple White House administrations and ending our presence while needed is easier said and done.
    This.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    Thats a valid point. Im all for if we're gonna talk about it, lets talk about all sides of it.

    I would ask now though, do we think the numbers that voted based solely on race will vote differently now because of what changes have or have not comeforth, or are they going to stick to the race card, be it for or against?
    You asked a really good question.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by yage202 Click here to enlarge
    Obama got 96% of the black voted in 2008, so getting 95% of the black vote in 2012 is no improvement. The poll was flawed to begin with. “The numbers came from a statistically significant sample of more than 100 African-American voters out of 1,000 total voters in the poll,”. So the media pumps up the results of a sampling that includes 100 African-american voters out of a population of 42 million. Seems a far stretch of statistics to extrapolate those polls results to the whole population of African-Americans.

    More BS meant to incite, divide and inflame!
    I should have read that. You're right, the results are skewed. You need at least 2,000 for a good sampling.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
    I should have read that. You're right, the results are skewed. You need at least 2,000 for a good sampling.
    1000 is good enough a long as your proportions are right... if out of 1000, 130 are black as 13% of thr Us is african american, then its definitely accurate.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    1000 is good enough a long as your proportions are right... if out of 1000, 130 are black as 13% of thr Us is african american, then its definitely accurate.
    I'm no statistician, but I learned the sampling size figure I mentioned in college. So, I was just relying on that. As a layman on this subject, I can't imagine how 130 respondents would be enough to accurately reflect on a group with a population in the millions.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
    You asked a really good question.
    I thought so Click here to enlarge

    Im really just so sick of hearing the race card being played. To me, this is no different than Taliban and AQI insurgency tactics..

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    lol... i am with sticky on this one and i rarely agree with him. Its funny how Bill Cosby consistently gets made fun out when he is the only one to tell the truth and frankly this is why balcks domt like him either. You want to know something else, he grew up in a Ghetto in Philly and has a PHD while being a Millionaire. No one glorifies him... its a funny world.
    Actually Bill has a EhD which is in Education not a PhD for the sake of reference and many honorary degrees. But again from the outside looking is the perspective you have. Bill has made some interesting points and some wacky suggestions as well. No matter in the end he was vocal for a short time and got quiet again. However he has not said anything said previously or currently in many cases.
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    This thread reminded me of this:


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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    1000 is good enough a long as your proportions are right... if out of 1000, 130 are black as 13% of thr Us is african american, then its definitely accurate.
    It is only accurate if the sample is pulled from all social and economic classes of African Americans. In LA, I can change those results by sample polling South Central vs Ladera Heights, or nationally Birmingham, AL vs Seattle, WA. Never accept a poll result until you have the assumptions or how the pool of people used to create the poll were developed. While the poll could be accurate, there is not enough information to say the poll is definitely accurate.

    Yes, he could have complained and he has far more reason to complain than black people in this country in this day and age. Slavery ended over two centuries ago. No African American children are being denied any opportunity or having their families lives ruined and being deported to some isolated area.

    Rather than sitting around saying things aren't fair and pointing fingers he did something crazy. He educated himself and worked. Nobody is stopping any minority from doing the same.
    While slavery ended 142 years ago, economic and political disenfranchisement only ended in the 1960's during my lifetime (insert appropriate old man jokes here). Until then, there were no civil rights or voting rights expected in the African American community.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by yage202 Click here to enlarge
    It is only accurate if the sample is pulled from all social and economic classes of African Americans. In LA, I can change those results by sample polling South Central vs Ladera Heights, or nationally Birmingham, AL vs Seattle, WA. Never accept a poll result until you have the assumptions or how the pool of people used to create the poll were developed. While the poll could be accurate, there is not enough information to say the poll is definitely accurate.
    I hate to say it but that would essentially make all polls inaccurate.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by yage202 Click here to enlarge
    While slavery ended 142 years ago, economic and political disenfranchisement only ended in the 1960's during my lifetime (insert appropriate old man jokes here). Until then, there were no civil rights or voting rights expected in the African American community.
    Is it still 1960?

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