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  1. #51
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Velocity26 Click here to enlarge
    Moving the entry point downward (on the pic) would reduce the almost 180 degree turn that the air has to make to feel the #1 cylinder.
    This is exactly what would help optimize the design.
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


    Click here to enlarge

  2. #52
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    Explain "downward". There is no room to move the TB any further towards cyl 1. Alternator will hit, and I will not relocate that.

  3. #53
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Mat Morkin Click here to enlarge
    Explain "downward". There is no room to move the TB any further towards cyl 1. Alternator will hit, and I will not relocate that.
    Can it be moved more to the right?
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


    Click here to enlarge

  4. #54
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    Let me take this information, mull over it a bit and see what I can do.

  5. #55
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    I mean to remove the curve on the inside of the turn, look more like this:

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
    Try and make it look like this.


    Attachment 18516

  6. #56
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Velocity26 Click here to enlarge
    I mean to remove the curve on the inside of the turn, look more like this:
    Smoothing always helps. Mat, can you take the steps out of the TB exit? Since this is a cast part, it would be very easy to do. Try and take that step out near the TB where it dumps into the plenum, make it a smooth transition if you can.
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


    Click here to enlarge

  7. #57
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    Mat, I overlayed the manifolds. Your rev3 manifold is a better design than rev4. I wouldnt move the TB like you did in rev4, keep it as far away from the inlet ports as possible. By moving the TB closer, you close the angle made between the TB and cylinder 6 which hurts diffusion.


    rev3 is green and rev4 is red.


    Click here to enlarge
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


    Click here to enlarge

  8. #58
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    When make my wood model, I will see what I can do about moving it back. What do you mean take the step out of the TB exit? I am trying to find a step there, there is a step into the runner from the plenum, I would like to remove it. I will do it this weekend.

  9. #59
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    What I mean is smooth out the transition from TB dumping into the plenum, it is very abrupt. Think about stretching a sheet body out from the TB orifice to all corners of the inside of the plenum, this effect will disturb the flow less.
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


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  10. #60
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    Drawings could minimize the misunderstandings.

  11. #61
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 654 Click here to enlarge
    Drawings could minimize the misunderstandings.
    I'm going to put something together, I think it should clarify some things.
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


    Click here to enlarge

  12. #62
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    Mat, this is what I am trying to say.

    Click here to enlarge

    Regardless of the design this should be incorporated, it will cost nothing extra.
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


    Click here to enlarge

  13. #63
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    Got it. Let me see what I can come up with. What about the steps leading into the runners, like the way rev 3 is?

  14. #64
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    Runners are ok, just the TB joint at the plenum. Smooth that guy out, think of it as if you had silly putty and could smear it on every surface on the inside of the plenum, no aburpt changes in direction is what the fluid wants.
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


    Click here to enlarge

  15. #65
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
    Mat, this is what I am trying to say.

    Regardless of the design this should be incorporated, it will cost nothing extra.
    I'm really glad to see somebody taking on this project. Coming from the supra community to the N54 platform I was a little disappointed in the amount of mods available. Keep up the good work guys! I know it's a long and iterative process but it will be worth it in the end.

    DBFIU, the abrupt entrance into the plenum would cause more turbulence. Correct? By stepping it down you are essentially trying to keep the flow laminar through this region? (Trying to remember the basics from fluids class Click here to enlarge)

  16. #66
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SJ_1989 Click here to enlarge
    I'm really glad to see somebody taking on this project. Coming from the supra community to the N54 platform I was a little disappointed in the amount of mods available. Keep up the good work guys! I know it's a long and iterative process but it will be worth it in the end.

    DBFIU, the abrupt entrance into the plenum would cause more turbulence. Correct? By stepping it down you are essentially trying to keep the flow laminar through this region? (Trying to remember the basics from fluids class Click here to enlarge)
    In essence yes. The flow is always turbulent by the nature of the number called Reynolds number. What you want to prevent is not necessarily turbulent flow, because that cannot be prevented due to the high reynolds number, I am trying to prevent secondary vorticies from forming inside the plenum due to the step change, at the corner where the TB meets the plenum there will be a vena contracta which is an effect reduction in flow area. Instead of a 3" TB, the air actually 'feels' like its a 2.7" TB because of the vena contracta. The way to get rid of that is with a diffusion angle less than 8 degrees which I think is possible given the closeness of the diameter of the TB with the height of the plenum (they arent too far off and a gradual slope into the ends of the plenum where the ports are can net us an 8 degree diffusion angle which is money).
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


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  17. #67
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    Rev 4

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  18. #68
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Mat Morkin Click here to enlarge
    Rev 4

    Click here to enlarge
    call it rev 5 or else im gonna be confused Click here to enlarge all my files are arranged by rev number.
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


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  19. #69
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    You've got mail at the shella address.It is this, or taper the whole plenum from 5" to 3.25", but I will loose a lot of volume that way.

  20. #70
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    Try to taper the whole plenum from the TB exit. There is still a step at the TB plenum interface.
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


    Click here to enlarge

  21. #71
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    I was trying not to have to start over, but I guess I just need to wipe the slate clean, haha. It is hard to do that because of the angle the plenum takes. I'll get it.

  22. #72
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    It will be worth it trust me, also your PM's are all blank, I am not sure what is going on but they are not showing up with any text.
    Some people live long, meaningful lives.

    Other people eat shit and die.

    I'm not racist, I hate everybody equally; especially fat people.


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  23. #73
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    Must be my iPad or something some times it screws up my emails too. Sorry

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Mat Morkin Click here to enlarge
    I was trying not to have to start over, but I guess I just need to wipe the slate clean, haha. It is hard to do that because of the angle the plenum takes. I'll get it.
    Since you are going to have a lot of power having the GTX's, you'd need to get a very even delivery across the cylinders, not only for air, but also to get the meth evenly distributed and thus having both banks with decent AFRs. Developing great stuff takes a lot of time.

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