• Over 500 whp already out of the 2015 BMW F80 M3? Yep. BMS JB4 tuned S55 turbo inline-6 ethanol (E85) testing shows 539 wheel horsepower

      So, um, yes, you can say the new F80 M3 and F82 M4 respond pretty well to bolt on modifications. Journalists are still getting their hands on stock cars to test but Burger Tuning (BMS) already has the car over 500 wheel horsepower. This is not too surprising as with a mild bump in boost on a beta Stage I BMS tune the car already showed 479 horsepower at the wheels. Now with some further refinement to the tune and some ethanol (E85) the result is over 500 whp.

      Here are the details in the words of Terry@BMS:




      Hey guys,

      Got back from a couple hours of dyno tuning and came back with some interesting results. This car definitely likes E85...

      The JB4 now has full electronic wastegate control in addition to the fuel mass control & CANbus, paving the way for E85 testing. The test car is our 2015 DCT M3, 100% stock with a JB4, with ethanol mixed with 91 octane at 30-50%.

      I've been running E30 for the last week on a tune that ramps up to around 25psi and I've been very impressed with it. On the dyno today running that same trim resulting in a very consistent ~510whp / ~510wtq results. Although the turbo holds boost to redline it looks like shifting around 6000 rpm will result in the best acceleration results as power noses off above that.

      While I had it strapped down I decided to explore more aggressive power levels. Added a little more E85 and went on an hour long adventure through many different curves and tweaks. Finally arrived at a 28psi peak tune which yielded ~540whp / ~575wtq. I've not tested this much on the street so we'll have to see how viable it is. But this just goes to show you how much room was left on the table for tuning with this platform.

      This car is an animal.














      This article was originally published in forum thread: 2015 M3 JB4 Ethanol Testing & Dyno started by Terry@BMS View original post
      Comments 264 Comments
      1. VargasTurboTech's Avatar
        VargasTurboTech -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by -335i- Click here to enlarge
        Nice work!

        Now when the EWG is fully controllable with JB4, I'd love to see someone to chime in and develop EWG for N54 too.

        I've never liked the vacuum cotrolled wastegates. Click here to enlarge
        The Vacuum gates leave a lot to be desired such as rattle, etc. BUT they do offer a LOT of control, if you think of a single port boost controled actuator you are have a spring keeping it closed and as heavy as that spring is, is as heavy as you will be able to keep the gate closed unless you go to a twin port, which for IWG system are proven not to work, but with the vacuum gates you can add more vacuum and get a heavier closing pressure on the gate itself, we have tested all of these and at 15 IN/HG and 22 in/HG the amount of force it takes to open them is much much greater. So they do work well with just some bad side effects.
      1. BlackJetE90OC's Avatar
        BlackJetE90OC -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
        You also do this to many threads, purposely poke the bear then pretend like it was an accident and apologize, the second you posted I called it for exactly what it was, the end of a good thread and the start of this mess.
        Exactly its was the typical non-S65 owner in post number 21.

        Just an observation, 9 times out of 10 it is a non-S65 owner that starts the sh*t talking.

        So it they want the S65 out of their threads. Then don't F*CKING bring it up.
      1. rawad1017's Avatar
        rawad1017 -
        n54 owners are $#@!y little girls.

        neg rep me to death if you'd like but it's the truth
      1. VargasTurboTech's Avatar
        VargasTurboTech -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rawad1017 Click here to enlarge
        n54 owners are $#@!y little girls.

        neg rep me to death if you'd like but it's the truth
        Another mature addition to the thread. Spoken like a true non $#@!y adult
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by nafoo Click here to enlarge
        Dang, Stage 2+ Supercharged S65 or M4. Decisions!
        My personal opinion is if you intend to stop at that get the new car.

        It depends on your goals and what type of motor you like to drive.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ChuckD05 Click here to enlarge
        @Sticky When is your car estimated to be completed ?
        It already should be but I'll call.

        It's not the car being completed it's a new set of upgrades to the transmission.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
        Sticky, I do not give a rats ass about your reasoning, look at what you single handedly have done to this thread and countless others AGAIN, if you were a member you would neg repped to death and called a troll of epic proportions, that you have ruined another thread is honestly as embarrassing for you as it is $#@!ty for the thread owner. Your constant arguing about 1 single platform that accounts to 3% of your forum traffic and constant bashing of your members who account for the other 97% is again embarrassing. You would be much better served to stop this before it gets any worse
        I'm not going to keep repeating myself that we'll talk about whatever we want to talk about here. If we want to debate M motors for 100 pages that is none of your concern.

        I don't care if you have a problem with it as this forum wasn't created to appease you. I don't even know why you keep harping about it. I've come to an understanding with several of the people I've engaged with and I respect their position and they respect mine. It's ok to disagree, there's nothing wrong with it. We're car enthusiasts talking about cars which is what this place is about.

        Frankly, I really enjoyed this thread the only problem is your idiotic $#@!ing. Just shut up and move on already if you don't like it because nobody is about to stop. We're enthusiasts and we have passion for the topic. The only thing that is embarrassing is the constant stream of negativity coming from a 'professional' business account. If it continues, I'll put it new rules regarding that conduct.

        Considering four vendors just signed on I think you should concentrate on your own business and let me worry about what engines I want to discuss and when and where I want to discuss them on the forum I own.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
        You also do this to many threads, purposely poke the bear then pretend like it was an accident and apologize, the second you posted I called it for exactly what it was, the end of a good thread and the start of this mess.
        What mess? Enthusiasts debating and engaging about their respective platforms? What, it's too intense for you? It bothers you?

        If a little heated debate is too much for you I don't know what to say. This is BimmerBoost where people can get into a more enthusiastic discussion without some moderator pushing them toward being PC and pretending everyone is holding hands and crapping rainbows.

        You've done more to derail this thread than anyone and your initial posting took a negative slant. You continue to derail it with these types of posts.

        We want to talk so let us freaking talk. It's a forum. It's BimmerBoost. It's not let's sing songs and hold hands.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
        It actually doesn't take more than one person to derail a thread, when that person comes in a multi quotes everyones posts and starts the same garbage again as he did in the last thread, that one person just derailed the thread, SAME exact $#@! LM used to do, he got suspended for it, Sticky is the Mod so its cool. Makes me visit here less and less
        He got suspended because guess who helped you out? Do you remember the PM's you sent me about it? Now you're doing the same thing you got upset for others doing to you. How quickly we forget...
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Legionofboom Click here to enlarge
        Maybe I will, maybe I won't. It's a online forum, take a step back and don't get bent out of shape about it. Terry is getting front page news because of it. Sticky is getting something to rant about.

        The forum is active at least, it's been $#@!ing dead for the past few weeks.

        Go work on stage 3 kits, we're all waiting to give you our money.
        I wasn't even on much during the week of July 4th. The views are up but it is summer and people do go outside.

        This isn't a rant it's a discussion regarding engine design with actual technical aspects to it. I think people could learn quite a bit.

        Anyway @Legionofboom you're about to get 40 more forums on the network. You'll have more to read than you'll have time to read.
      1. Torgus's Avatar
        Torgus -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I'm not going to keep repeating myself that we'll talk about whatever we want to talk about here. If we want to debate M motors for 100 pages that is none of your concern.
        Just goes to show you only want threads to stay on or off topic when you want them to and it is convenient for you. See the VM turbo kit announcement thread. It turned into the usually S65 $#@! hole thread derailment. Why did that thread need to go back on topic but this one is fine? Both were threads started by vendors and went off into you explaining to all of us for the 1000th time why the S65 is so superior to every engine and that anyone who brings up the ridiculous cost should shut up.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Torgus Click here to enlarge
        Just goes to show you only want threads to stay on or off topic when you want them to and it is convenient for you.
        No. I didn't introduce the topic, I responded to it. The front page article is up and the initial posts are all in place. What more is there to say? The discussion then went to comments about previous M motors. It's ok for a discussion to evolve.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Torgus Click here to enlarge
        See the VM turbo kit announcement thread. It turned into the usually S65 $#@! hole thread derailment. Why did that thread need to go back on topic but this one is fine? Both were threads started by vendors and went off into you explaining to all of us for the 1000th time why the S65 is so superior to every engine and that anyone who brings up the ridiculous cost should shut up.
        Yep people brought up the topic and I responded just as I did here and I asked for it to go back on topic to discuss that manifold. An S55 comparison to the previous M motor is going to be pretty natural especially initially. I'll gladly contribute my position if that comparison is made which it was. Because the VM turbo thread went back on topic doesn't mean this one can't either. It also doesn't mean we can't have natural discussions. Threads here often go off track as people just have a normal discussion. Not exactly news and secondly it's not even a problem it's what I like about this place and the way people can discuss topics.

        Whining about it is lame. Discussing the topic which is about M engines makes more sense in M engine sections.
      1. VargasTurboTech's Avatar
        VargasTurboTech -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Torgus Click here to enlarge
        Just goes to show you only want threads to stay on or off topic when you want them to and it is convenient for you. See the VM turbo kit announcement thread. It turned into the usually S65 $#@! hole thread derailment. Why did that thread need to go back on topic but this one is fine? Both were threads started by vendors and went off into you explaining to all of us for the 1000th time why the S65 is so superior to every engine and that anyone who brings up the ridiculous cost should shut up.
        Literally all you can do is give up and ignore it. I honestly have never seen anyone derail so many threads over something so trivial and blame everyone else since LM finally left a while back. Its honestly been driving me to other forums and I find myself spending less and less time here
      1. Torgus's Avatar
        Torgus -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        No. I didn't introduce the topic, I responded to it. The front page article is up and the initial posts are all in place. What more is there to say? The discussion then went to comments about previous M motors. It's ok for a discussion to evolve.



        Yep people brought up the topic and I responded just as I did here and I asked for it to go back on topic to discuss that manifold. An S55 comparison to the previous M motor is going to be pretty natural especially initially. I'll gladly contribute my position if that comparison is made which it was. Because the VM turbo thread went back on topic doesn't mean this one can't either. It also doesn't mean we can't have natural discussions threads here often go off track as people just have a discussion. Not exactly news and secondly it's not even a problem it's what I like about this place and the way people can discuss topics.

        It went back on topic because you said it should go back on topic:

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        The topic is a new turbo kit. Talk about that.
        Why did you care in that thread but not here?
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Torgus Click here to enlarge
        It went back on topic because you said it should go back on topic:

        Why did you care in that thread but not here?
        Did I not just explain to you that there is no reason the same can not happen here? The difference is in that topic it is a new product release in the N54 forum that is predominantly dominated by N54's and it has far more exposure than the new section here. This is about dyno's of a new M motor with Ethanol as in a different topic.

        Additionally, as this is a new M motor and this is not about a new product but it is about testing people speculate on the power output with modifications then make the natural comparison to the previous generation M motors. When that comparison is made or people make statements about the previous generation M motor that I find incorrect I chime in. It is a natural evolution of the topic and practically inevitable especially as there are S65 owners here who people like to prod. Prod, you will be prodded back. Probably harder.

        Do I even owe you some kind of explanation on why two different topics with different participants have different outcomes? It is not apples to apples to begin with. Additionally I have no problem with this discussion. Why you do as if debating M motors and power outputs is out of line on BimmerBoost is absurd. But hey, be negative and grasp for whatever you can in that respect. I'm more than happy to go back to discussing the engines instead of why we are discussing the engines.
      1. nafoo's Avatar
        nafoo -
        S55 > N54. There I said it. What now Legionofpoop!
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
        Literally all you can do is give up and ignore it. I honestly have never seen anyone derail so many threads over something so trivial and blame everyone else since LM finally left a while back. Its honestly been driving me to other forums and I find myself spending less and less time here
        As the thread shows the topic was introduced by multiple individuals before any post by me.

        Additionally, I think it's a good idea to take a break from time to time. You're free to do whatever you want. This forums was formed so people could discuss automotive topics for as long as they want to without interruption even if the discussion gets heated. If you don't like this there are other places as you alluded to.

        Also, I have done everything you have requested of me have I not? And gone over and beyond? That doesn't mean I suddenly have to stop talking when you tell me to or when you don't like what I say. I could say plenty more but I won't.
      1. Legionofboom's Avatar
        Legionofboom -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by nafoo Click here to enlarge
        S55 > N54. There I said it. What now Legionofpoop!
        wahwah ill neg rep you!!! haha kidding, I don't care man, I love my car, I enjoy the BMW brand and I enjoy this forum. I made a comment that Terry later agreed with, and sticky got bent on it, which I understand, it is sticky after all, but now you guys are just dragging it out.

        It's just a internet forum to talk about BMWs, sometimes people take it much to serious.
      1. -335i-'s Avatar
        -335i- -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
        The Vacuum gates leave a lot to be desired such as rattle, etc. BUT they do offer a LOT of control, if you think of a single port boost controled actuator you are have a spring keeping it closed and as heavy as that spring is, is as heavy as you will be able to keep the gate closed unless you go to a twin port, which for IWG system are proven not to work, but with the vacuum gates you can add more vacuum and get a heavier closing pressure on the gate itself, we have tested all of these and at 15 IN/HG and 22 in/HG the amount of force it takes to open them is much much greater. So they do work well with just some bad side effects.
        I agree. But the bad side effects are those which I would like to get rid off. Rattle, gates slight opening on some boost conditions, etc. With electronic wastegates there's less components and the adjust would be very accurate. There's plenty of PWM controlled linear actuators out there, so I guess the hardware is not a big issue, just choosing the right one; stroke length, speed, force and heat resistance + designing the proper bolt on support. (I know there's always issues popping up when actually starting to create one.) What comes to PWM control, I guess it would be needing some kind of simple circuit to scale/modulate/amplify the vacuum solenoids signal.
      1. crazylegs's Avatar
        crazylegs -
        so what about that power under the curve everyone! how would you have to build an N54 to be similar in power under curve and have say 600Hp across the board?