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    • German, Japanese, and American battle royale - 2014 Nissan GT-R Track Edition vs. Porsche 911 Turbo S vs. Camaro Z/28

      Is the Camaro Z28 overpriced at $75k? It has the venerable LS7 from the C6 Z06 at 505 horsepower clearly giving up power and torque to its German and Japanese rivals. It also has no turbos and no dual clutch transmission. Just a big 427 cubic inch naturally aspirated single overhead cam pushrod American V8 mated to the classic manual transmission. Is the Z28 in over its head against the $117,305 Nissan GT-R Track Edition and $182,050 911 Turbo S?


      Nope. And that $75k base price all of a sudden looks like a value in this company, doesn't it? What that money buys you is a Camaro that takes the roadcourse very seriously. 305/30/19 Pirelli Pzero Trofeo R tires are featured all around. Yes, 305's up front. There also are 15.5 inch carbon ceramic brakes rotors up front as well. The GT-R is the only one in this group without carbon ceramic brakes.

      The Camaro is clearly set up for roadcourse duty. It is also the slowest car of the group. A 12.3 @ 117.2 in the 1/4 mile certainly is not slow but it trails behind the GT-R with its 11.0 @ 125.1 run and the 911 Turbo S with its 10.9 @ 123.7. The 911 Turbo S again shows abnormally slow 1/4 mile numbers dying for some reason past 100 miles per hour despite being the first car to get there. Is the ECU cutting power? It sure looks like it.

      So the Camaro does not have a fancy dual clutch transmission, it does not have all wheel drive, and it isn't the most powerful. It isn't a lightweight either weighing 3857 pounds. 23 pounds lighter than the Nissan GT-R but 247 pounds heavier than the 911 Turbo S.

      That makes the Camaro beating the GT-R and the 911 Turbo S around the roadcourse all the more impressive because the car is doing it in the turns and not due to a power advantage. The cheaper rear wheel drive manual American car beats the more expensive dual clutch all wheel drive foreign robots that the automotive world seems to constantly rave about. There is some poetic justice in there somewhere.




      MotorTrend picks the Camaro as the best car in this test followed by the 911 Turbo S and then the GT-R. The GT-R is said to feel too controlled. In other words, it's boring. Who was it that told you it's a soulless robot? The 911 Turbo S also suffers from missing an 'X factor' in the driving experience. The GT3 would have been a better choice and addressed the driver involvement criticism. Now you likely understand why Porsche offers a GT3 and why horsepower is not everything.

      MotorTrend says the Camaro Z28 is GM at its best and it is tough to disagree. GM is definitely on a bit of a roll right now. A Camaro that is a better driver's car than a Porsche 911 Turbo and beats it around the roadcourse for $100k less is, well, unheard of until now. It is now the Porsche that is the dragster and the not the American 'muscle' car.

      Good for you GM. Way to beat the world's best without even needing to match the cost of entry. Thank you for building the Z28.

      3rd Place: Nissan GT-R Track Edition

      Old soldiers never die, they just fade away. Still a monster, but long in the tooth. The 2015 refresh arrives none too soon.

      2nd Place: Porsche 911 Turbo S


      One of the quickest production cars of all time, the Turbo S is caught in a weird space between grand touring and track attack.

      1st Place: Chevrolet Camaro Z/28


      Impressive. Most impressive. The General flexes its red, white, and blue muscles. Simply put, this is Chevy at its best.




      2014 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28 2014 Nissan GT-R Track Edition 2014 Porsche 911 Turbo S
      POWERTRAIN/CHASSIS
      DRIVETRAIN LAYOUT Front-engine, RWD Front-engine, AWD Rear-engine, AWD
      ENGINE TYPE 90-deg V-8, aluminum block/heads Twin-turbo 60-deg V-6, aluminum block/heads Twin-turbo flat-6, aluminum block/heads
      VALVETRAIN OHV, 2 valves/cyl DOHC, 4 valves/cyl DOHC, 4 valves/cyl
      DISPLACEMENT 427.9 cu in/7011 cc 231.8 cu in/3799 cc 231.9 cu in/3800 cc
      COMPRESSION RATIO 11.0:1 9.0:1 9.8:1
      POWER (SAE NET) 505 hp @ 6100 rpm* 545 hp @ 6400 rpm 560 hp @ 6500 rpm
      TORQUE (SAE NET) 481 lb-ft @ 4800 rpm* 463 lb-ft @ 3200 rpm 516 lb-ft @ 2100 rpm**
      REDLINE 7000 rpm 7000 rpm 7000 rpm
      WEIGHT TO POWER 7.6 lb/hp 7.1 lb/hp 6.4 lb/hp
      TRANSMISSION 6-speed manual 6-speed twin-cl auto 7-speed twin-cl auto
      AXLE/FINAL-DRIVE RATIO 3.91:1/2.46:1 3.70:1/2.95:1 3.44:1/2.14:1
      SUSPENSION, FRONT; REAR Struts, coil springs, anti-roll bar; multilink, coil springs, anti-roll bar Control arms, coil springs, adj shocks, anti-roll bar; multilink, coil springs, adj shocks, anti-roll bar Struts, coil springs, adj shocks, anti-roll bar; multilink, coil springs, adj shocks, anti-roll bar
      STEERING RATIO 16.1:1 15.0:1 12.3:1-15.0:1
      TURNS LOCK-TO-LOCK 2.5 2.5 2.5
      BRAKES, F;R 15.5-in vented, drilled, carbon ceramic disc; 15.3-in vented, drilled, carbon ceramic disc, ABS 15.4-in vented, drilled disc; 15.0-in vented, drilled disc, ABS 16.1-in vented, drilled, carbon ceramic disc; 15.4-in vented, drilled, carbon ceramic disc, ABS
      WHEELS, F;R 11.0 x 19-in; 11.5 x 19-in, forged aluminum 9.5 x 20 in; 10.5 x 20 in, forged aluminum 9.0 x 20-in; 11.5 x 20-in forged aluminum
      TIRES, F;R 305/30R19 102Y
      Pirelli P Zero Trofeo R
      255/40R20 97Y; 285/35R20 100Y
      Dunlop SP Sport Maxx GT600 DSST CTT
      245/35R20 91Y; 305/30R20 103Y
      Pirelli P Zero
      DIMENSIONS
      WHEELBASE 112.3 in 109.4 in 96.5 in
      TRACK, F/R 66.1/64.7 in 62.6/63.0 in 60.6/62.6 in
      LENGTH x WIDTH x HEIGHT 192.3 x 76.9 x 52.4 in 183.8 x 74.6 x 53.9 in 177.4 x 74.0 x 51.0 in
      TURNING CIRCLE 37.7 ft (est) 36.6 ft 34.8 ft
      CURB WEIGHT 3857 lb 3880 lb 3610 lb
      WEIGHT DIST, F/R 53/47% 55/45% 39/61%
      SEATING CAPACITY 4 2 4
      HEADROOM, F/R 37.4/35.3 in 38.1/- in 37.8/26.0 in
      LEGROOM, F/R 42.4/29.9 in 44.6/- in 66.7/26.0 in (est)
      SHOULDER ROOM, F/R 56.9/42.5 in 54.3/- in 53.4/47.3 in
      CARGO VOLUME 11.3 cu ft 8.8 cu ft 9.2 cu ft
      TEST DATA
      ACCELERATION TO MPH
      0-30 1.7 sec 1.0 sec 1.0 sec
      0-40 2.3 1.5 1.4
      0-50 3.1 2.0 1.9
      0-60 4.0 2.7 2.6
      0-70 5.0 3.5 3.4
      0-80 6.2 4.5 4.4
      0-90 7.5 5.6 5.6
      0-100 9.0 6.9 6.8
      PASSING, 45-65 MPH 1.8 1.4 1.3
      QUARTER MILE 12.3 sec @ 117.2 mph 11.0 sec @ 125.1 mph 10.9 sec @ 123.7 mph
      BRAKING, 60-0 MPH 97 ft 94 ft 100 ft
      LATERAL ACCELERATION 1.06 g (avg) 1.02 g (avg) 1.04 g (avg)
      MT FIGURE EIGHT 23.6 sec @ 0.84 g (avg) 23.4 sec @ 0.89 g (avg) 23.0 sec @ 0.93 g (avg)
      2.3-MI ROAD COURSE LAP 96.17 sec 96.45 sec 96.34 sec
      TOP-GEAR REVS @ 60 MPH 1500 rpm 2150 rpm 1650 rpm
      CONSUMER INFO
      BASE PRICE $75,000 $117,305 $182,050
      PRICE AS TESTED $76,150 $117,590 $199,065
      STABILITY/TRACTION CONTROL Yes/yes Yes/yes Yes/yes
      AIRBAGS Dual front, front side, f/r rear curtain Dual front, front side, front curtain Dual front, front side, front curtain, front knee
      BASIC WARRANTY 3 yrs/36,000 mi 3 yrs/36,000 mi 4 yrs/50,000 mi
      POWERTRAIN WARRANTY 5 yrs/100,000 mi 5 yrs/60,000 mi 4 yrs/50,000 mi
      ROADSIDE ASSISTANCE 5 yrs/100,000 mi 5 yrs/60,000 mi 4 yrs/50,000 mi
      FUEL CAPACITY 19.0 gal 19.5 gal 16.9 gal
      EPA CITY/HWY/COMB ECON 13/19/15 mpg (est) 16/23/19 mpg 17/24/20 mpg
      ENERGY CONS, CITY/HWY 259/177 kW-hrs/100 mi (est) 211/147 kW-hrs/100 mi 198/140 kW-hrs/100 mi
      CO2 EMISSIONS, COMB 1.28 lb/mi (est) 1.05 lb/mi 0.99 lb/mi
      RECOMMENDED FUEL Unleaded premium Unleaded premium Unleaded premium
      *SAE certified
      **553 lb-ft w/temporary 20-sec overboost


      This article was originally published in forum thread: German, Japanese, and American battle royale - 2014 Nissan GT-R Track Edition vs. Porsche 911 Turbo S vs. Camaro Z/28 started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 56 Comments
      1. Stevenh's Avatar
        Stevenh -
        Click here to enlarge
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      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        ^ Good post. Deserves its own article.
      1. mjmarovi's Avatar
        mjmarovi -
        This car is awesome, no other way around it. It is exactly what the Z28 is suppose to be. Someone said the corvette would be a better comparison? What?! Are you serious? It's not enough for you that Chevy is beating the big guys with their step down you want them to bring out their best? What for? You want your precious euro car to get lapped? I'm not sure what you're asking man...
        @Sticky please do not lump TWO opinions into the rest of this forum. Give us a chance to post. This car is awesome, and $#@! anybody who wants to post a 1/4 mile time only and discount the american car for not winning that battle. Lets face it unless the dragstrip is 1/2 mile or greater that type of racing is fading away. Why? Cause cars are getting better, they can turn now, welcome to 2014. Thanks.

        Oh yeah... Ford...Mustang? where you at? Lets see your answer! The Ford vs Chevy rivalry is fueling performance right now, and this car is only going to push it further. I want another american car right now...bad.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
        Oh yeah... Ford...Mustang? where you at? Lets see your answer! The Ford vs Chevy rivalry is fueling performance right now, and this car is only going to push it further. I want another american car right now...bad.
        The GT350 will be their answer and if it has the Vodoo flat-plane crank 5.0 liter V8 revving to 8000 rpm... watch out.
      1. zeel's Avatar
        zeel -
        Click here to enlarge

        Felt this was appropriate.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        ^ Edited to delete your duplicate attachment.
      1. zeel's Avatar
        zeel -
        Thank you sir!
      1. E90Company's Avatar
        E90Company -
        Right now America is winning and Europe is losing. And I don't feel bad at all.
      1. rawad1017's Avatar
        rawad1017 -
        eh i just really underestimated the z/28 because i've driven a relative's SS camaro (loved every second of it btw) and it just did not scream versatile to me. wasn't aware of the suspension lol whoops, my mistake.

        i'm happy for american car companies raising the bar Click here to enlarge
      1. leveraged sellout's Avatar
        leveraged sellout -
        I'll still take a GT3 over any of them, and gladly pay the premium. I actually really do like the Z/28, but its just not my style. I respect the hell out of it though. And it looks badass too.
      1. ChuckD05's Avatar
        ChuckD05 -


        i wasnt informed well enough on this car... pretty impressive.. but some coils and tune on the gtr throw the gtr out ahead rather easily but def impressive
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ChuckD05 Click here to enlarge
        but some coils and tune on the gtr throw the gtr out ahead rather easily but def impressive
        Then you throw a tune and a cam in the Z28... the LS7 is going to make power and a lot of it at that.
      1. Autobahn335i's Avatar
        Autobahn335i -
        Interesting outcome! Finally a car which might make Porsche think again about the direction their cars have taken. I'm not a fan at all of the new GT3 as it misses the raw track spirit of the previous generations. Not even talking about the ridiculous price tag.

        I'll admit I didn't expect that kick in the butt coming from the west. At least not before the Stingray Z06 would surface.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Autobahn335i Click here to enlarge
        I'm not a fan at all of the new GT3 as it misses the raw track spirit of the previous generations.
        The main thing IMO it is missing is the race derived motor. Porsche is paying for this. I wouldn't say the car is not raw though. It is.

        As raw as the 997 GT3 RS 4.0? No. But still raw.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Autobahn335i Click here to enlarge
        I'll admit I didn't expect that kick in the butt coming from the west. At least not before the Stingray Z06 would surface.
        I think even the Z51 stingray would have done pretty well here. It's lighter than all of these cars.
      1. DavidV's Avatar
        DavidV -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Why no way? 305 R compounds all around. Superior suspension. No turbo lag.

        The Camaro once moving isn't giving up much of anything at speed the LS7 is a beast of a motor with a flatter curve AND it revs higher than either of these. When an M beats more powerful competition you guys don't act like this.

        The Camaro is lightened with a wider track. The Corvette will do even better than this. Do you guys not understand what the Z28 is?
        ^This.
        Good racing compound tires, top of the line suspension, wide track, a decent motor, and throwing in Carbon brakes makes this a pretty nice track car and really tough to beat.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
        Right now America is winning and Europe is losing.
        Click here to enlarge You know the car to beat was the GT-R, right? FYI Japan is not in Europe.


        The comparisen would have been more fair (on a tracktest) if all cars would have been on R-compound, but I do see why they tested the cars as Out Of The Box Experiences.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DavidV Click here to enlarge
        You know the car to beat was the GT-R, right? FYI Japan is not in Europe.
        That's not exactly it. It isn't about a single car. The upcoming CTS-V is gunning for the E63 / M5 etc.

        The Americans are firing on all fronts.
      1. DavidV's Avatar
        DavidV -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        That's not exactly it. It isn't about a single car. The upcoming CTS-V is gunning for the E63 / M5 etc.

        The Americans are firing on all fronts.
        This is true for the USA market I believe.
        Here in Europe (the Netherlands at least, can't speak for all European tax systems on cars) an American muscle car is just not worth the money at all.
        With the CO2 taxes here these care cost way way beyond what they're worth.
        A normal Camaro here is over $150,000.-
        Nobody buys them here, at all.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DavidV Click here to enlarge
        This is true for the USA market I believe.
        Here in Europe (the Netherlands at least, can't speak for all European tax systems on cars) an American muscle car is just not worth the money at all.
        With the CO2 taxes here these care cost way way beyond what they're worth.
        A normal Camaro here is over $150,000.-
        Nobody buys them here, at all.
        That sucks...
      1. DavidV's Avatar
        DavidV -
        This is why all European cars and manufacturers that export cars to Europe are going Turbo, even for the smallest engines.
        This reduces the CO2, and as a result makes the cars cheaper.

        Also, the EU demands for the average CO2 allowance for car manufacturers is getting ridiculous within the next 6 years.
        Expect much next generation performance cars to follow the Mc Laren P1 and Porsche 918 route to make hybrids.
        These cars are the role models and must massage every petrol head's mind into believing they want a hybrid for their next performance car.
        BMW is leading this "low end supercar" with their i8. It could become a bigger hit than everyone imagined last year.
        The new generation M5 is already way cheaper then the old V10 was, only due to a smaller CO2 tax.

        The costs of developing and implementing performance hybrid systems will come down, and (European) car manufacturers will be forced to implement these systems due to regulation restrictions.
      1. inlineS54B32's Avatar
        inlineS54B32 -
        I am a bit surprised - I know it's not all about straight-line speed, but something doesn't seem right with some of the numbers. Look at the 0-100 MPH (0-160 km/h):


        0-100:

        Z/28 9.0s
        GT-R 6.9s (a full 2.1 seconds quicker)
        911 6.8s (2.2s quicker)


        The 1/4 mile pretty much keeps up with this same result - albeit having a bit higher weight, and a lesser power to weight ratio, the Z/28 seems like it's making everything up in the corners/braking.

        I guess the suspension is probably setup as a complete race-car, and not a streetable car? That's the only thing I can think of for the win. I don't understand how else this is possible. It's a MUCH slower accelerating car, but must handle leap years better than the others?