• No 4Matic all wheel drive W205 C63 (C55)? AMG responds to the BMW M3/M4 weight loss with rear wheel drive C63 AMG

      Interesting development here coming out of the North American International Auto show in Detroit. Various sources are all reporting the same news that the head of AMG Tobias Moers stated the W205 C63 AMG would be rear wheel drive. Why is this interesting? Well the new 2014 W205 C300 and C400 are 4Matic only in the USA. There is no rear wheel drive W205 C-Class model for sale in the United States (although rear wheel drive models apparently will come for the next model year) and the E63 AMG and CLS63 along with the entry level 45 AMG are also sold in the USA as 4Matic only.

      At the end of last month reports surface that the W205 C63 also would not get a dual clutch transmission. This would make a lot of sense if the vehicle was all wheel drive as Mercedes would likely have the same torque concerns they do (and Audi as well) with sending a good amount of V8 twin turbo torque through a dual clutch transmission to all four wheels. We already know the engine is a 4.0 liter M177 V8 but the V8 twin turbo was confirmed with Tobias Moers on record. This motor also means the C55 name may be coming back since the motor will not be shared with the 63 AMG's.

      So why no all wheel drive? The first reason is likely the weight. The CLS63 AMG and E63 AMG both perform very well with all wheel drive but they are about 130 pounds heavier than their rear wheel drive counterparts. That is a significant amount of weight especially with most of it coming over the front wheels and especially with the main rival from BMW (M3/M4) coming in at 3306 pounds.

      With such a relatively low curb weight Mercedes would simply not be able to get close including all wheel drive, a twin turbo V8, and an automatic transmission. This despite the C-Class targeting weight savings of up to 220 pounds. Those 220 pounds though were not stated as to on what engine model, transmission, or driveline only as a maximum weight loss figure. Mercedes likely omitted specifying the weight savings in comparison to what previous model so that we would not be able to figure out the curb weight before they announced it. Not to mention they are still working on the C63.

      It is a foregone conclusion that if the C63 had 4Matic it would not be as playful as a chassis as the M3 and would be prone to far more understeer. Mercedes seems intent on making the C63 more of a drivers car and will include the trick electronic differential from the SLS Black Series. That means the C63 should be more capable of competing with the M3 in balance and driving excitement.

      Tobias Moers agrees stating, "You can have a lot of fun with the car on track with our 4Matic system, but I think the C-Class is more dedicated to fun-to-drive, more sporty, more race track--sometimes a little more sideways. That's the reason it's a rear-wheel drive car."

      This also begs the question, if rear wheel drive why no dual clutch transmission? Perhaps the answer is Mercedes upping the torque significantly once the M3/M4 specs were released. This is the danger in BMW releasing their next generation numbers before Mercedes. Due to the turbo era however it is not the risk it used to be as BMW will simply offer a performance package option if they need to. Then Mercedes will likely fire back with their own. They both win as they both will make more money on the option which they are well aware of.

      Additionally, it is important to note Tobias Moers did not state there never would be an all wheel drive C63. Will one come later as it did with the E63 refresh? Will they bump the power and do a C63 AMG S? Who knows, but the C63 just became a much more substantial rival for the M3. With approximately 130 less pounds to carry around than if it had the 4Matic system, it may just get close the CLA45 AMG's curb weight of 3600 pounds. It is practically a certainty it will be lighter than the W204 C63 AMG 3992 pounds. If Mercedes does lighten it by 220 pounds as they claim have been able to with the W205, that gives us 3772 pounds. We will have to wait and see.

      This article was originally published in forum thread: Next C63 Confirmed RWD started by BlackJetE90OC View original post
      Comments 57 Comments
      1. BlackJetE90OC's Avatar
        BlackJetE90OC -
        They definitely were not referring to the C63 when they said the C-class is dropping 220 lbs. They were referring to one of the base models. Who knows, Benz could even add further weight saving to the C63. Why not a carbon trunk, hood, or driveshaft like the M3/M4? What is great they have a weight figure thrown out there by BMW to try and get close too.
      1. m0v30v3r's Avatar
        m0v30v3r -
        I am quoting MBUSA's numbers.
        2014 C63 AMG SEDAN - Curb weight 3,649 lbs.
        2014 C63 AMG COUPE - Curb weight 3,816 lbs.

        If they shave ~200lb off the w205 C63 (which Tobias confirmed the name) and pair it with the biturbo V8 I think it will be a rocket.

        EDIT: forgot to mention that I HOPE Mercedes does not add PANORAMA sunroof as STANDARD as that is what really adds weight...
      1. 5soko's Avatar
        5soko -
        Im not happy imho with the M3/M4 specs, but i am looking forward to the this car! I wonder how much weight difference is between benz auto and a DCT unit?
        4matic, more weight and drivetrain loss.. AWD is nice to put the power down, which the current C63 has a issue with, but it does take out the crazyness rwd the C63 is known for.
      1. bigdnno98's Avatar
        bigdnno98 -
        TT V8 C63 AMG. Awesomeness!!!!! Talk about HP gap now to the M3. WOW
      1. Drunkenup's Avatar
        Drunkenup -
        just please no anorexic rear track and 255 mm tires again.. LSD standard too
      1. LZH's Avatar
        LZH -
        Bummer no AWD. I know lots of guys wanted the hooligan rear wheel drive but for putting the power down nothing beats AWD.
      1. TT C6's Avatar
        TT C6 -
        AWD is the ONLY reason I'm considering AMG. If no AWD for the C63, I'll just buy the S6/S4 for their DCT.
      1. TT C6's Avatar
        TT C6 -
        Where's my credit for posting and PMimg Sticky with this info ??????
      1. LZH's Avatar
        LZH -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TT C6 Click here to enlarge
        AWD is the ONLY reason I'm considering AMG. If no AWD for the C63, I'll just buy the S6/S4 for their DCT.
        I'm trading my S4 in for an S6 pretty soon. S6 blows the S4 away in every regard. Not to mention with a tune it'll walk off an leave just about anything. Ultimate sleeper.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by m0v30v3r Click here to enlarge
        I am quoting MBUSA's numbers.
        2014 C63 AMG SEDAN - Curb weight 3,649 lbs.
        2014 C63 AMG COUPE - Curb weight 3,816 lbs.

        If they shave ~200lb off the w205 C63 (which Tobias confirmed the name) and pair it with the biturbo V8 I think it will be a rocket.

        EDIT: forgot to mention that I HOPE Mercedes does not add PANORAMA sunroof as STANDARD as that is what really adds weight...
        That sedan figure is wayyy off.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Drunkenup Click here to enlarge
        just please no anorexic rear track and 255 mm tires again.. LSD standard too
        LSD is standard.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TT C6 Click here to enlarge
        Where's my credit for posting and PMimg Sticky with this info ??????
        You'll notice the OP posted this, then you pm'd about an hour later, and around 3 other users posted this info throughout the forum yesterday as well.
      1. M177's Avatar
        M177 -
        Still any idea about the price for the w205 c63 ?
      1. bobS's Avatar
        bobS -
        This car looks huge to me compared to the m3/m4. I hope they make it look sporty... Ok ow performance matters more but I'd be disappointed if this looks like a regular c class with a AMG bodykit. I want to see a cf roof, wider fenders, rear diffuser ....etc

        IMO merc doesn't do a great job making the AMG cars stand out.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bobS Click here to enlarge
        IMO merc doesn't do a great job making the AMG cars stand out.
        Black Series.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M177 Click here to enlarge
        Still any idea about the price for the w205 c63 ?
        $70k range or so I would guess. Nothing official.
      1. TT C6's Avatar
        TT C6 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        $70k range or so I would guess. Nothing official.
        $60k should be the MAX, and all I'll pay, for a LOADED C63.
        You can get a Audi S6 for $70k.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TT C6 Click here to enlarge
        $60k should be the MAX, and all I'll pay, for a LOADED C63.
        Well I wish you were in charge of pricing but I don't see how you can get a brand new one fully loaded for $60k.
      1. LZH's Avatar
        LZH -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TT C6 Click here to enlarge
        $60k should be the MAX, and all I'll pay, for a LOADED C63.
        You can get a Audi S6 for $70k.
        You won't find an S6 for $70k. The base models are around $75k and none of the dealers order base models, for that you would have to order it. And even a a base model is going to be around $1100/mo if you lease it. I don't think comparing the S6 and the C63 is an accurate comparison as the S6 is meant to compete with the E63.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
        S6 is meant to compete with the E63
        I think you mean E550.