• HPF Stage 2 Turbo S54 versus Active Autowerke supercharged S65 - E46 M3 versus E92 M3 - Torque versus horsepower

      Interesting race here showing the difference between two forced induction options offering different power curves. The Horsepower Freaks (RIP) Stage 2 Turbo E46 M3 in the video is definitely making more torque than the Active Autowerke Gen II Level III supercharged E92 M3. But, the E92 M3 is making its torque peak toward redline and having extra revs over the S54 inline-6 in the E46 M3 definitely shows its strength here as the supercharged E92 M3 is able to beat the turbocharged E46 M3.

      Both cars have meth injection and both are on the stock engine internals. The E46 M3 is slightly lighter but the E92 M3 has the quicker shifting transmission. The supercharged car wins this round no doubt causing a lot of turbo E46 M3 owners proclaiming superiority due to peak torque figures to scratch their heads. It's where you make the horsepower that counts in a roll on race and combine a strong top end with a quick shifting dual clutch and you have the result you see here.

      It will be interesting to see what happens when built motor E92 M3 S65 V8's go up against built motor E46 M3 S54 inline-6's. BimmerBoost will be sure to make that comparison happen.



      This article was originally published in forum thread: AA E92 LvL 3 VS Widebody HPF Level 2 started by Andrew@activeautowerke View original post
      Comments 95 Comments
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SexiPYm3 Click here to enlarge
        All that is great and all, but this video isn't a dig race, its a roll race. Launch control doesn't matter. And the all mighty dct is less of an advantage in roll racing vs 1/4 racing. It would make more of a difference if the race was very very close. Everyone loves talking about DCT like its going to make up a huge difference at these higher speeds. I've watched videos of hpf cars putting bus lengths on E9x M3s. DCT isn't changing that outcome. Now if the race is a matter of a car length distance, then yes, it would matter more. But like I said before, a stage 2 hpf car that has proper tuning and traction should pull on a stage 2 e9x m3 at the top of 4th gear.
        What are your specs on your car?
      1. SexiPYm3's Avatar
        SexiPYm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        What are your specs on your car?
        My specs?? I could be completely stock or maybe even stage 2.5. Not sure why that matters though. You had an invite to come to Jersey but you declined. So I'm not sure why you even care what I have.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SexiPYm3 Click here to enlarge
        My specs?? I could be completely stock or maybe even stage 2.5. Not sure why that matters though. You had an invite to come to Jersey but you declined. So I'm not sure why you even care what I have.
        I'm just curious about your car, aren't you on a car forum? I don't see what Jersey has to do with anything and why would I go somewhere to race when my car isn't ready to do so? Makes no sense.
      1. SexiPYm3's Avatar
        SexiPYm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I'm just curious about your car, aren't you on a car forum? I don't see what Jersey has to do with anything and why would I go somewhere to race when my car isn't ready to do so? Makes no sense.
        Yes I have a car, an e92, an e46 and hidden in a garage is a 300zx. There, you now know what I have. I simply mentioned the comment about Jersey because I thought maybe your interest in my specs could be because you'd like to personally find out. But no worries, my misunderstanding. And there are a bunch of guys on car forums that have no cars btw.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SexiPYm3 Click here to enlarge
        Yes I have a car, an e92, an e46 and hidden in a garage is a 300zx. There, you now know what I have. I simply mentioned the comment about Jersey because I thought maybe your interest in my specs could be because you'd like to personally find out. But no worries, my misunderstanding. And there are a bunch of guys on car forums that have no cars btw.
        I don't even know where you live, how would I?

        Yes but you are in particular are interested in a niche that I would assume you have a vehicle pertaining to. Hence the question.

        Regardless, what are the specs on your E46?
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SexiPYm3 Click here to enlarge
        All that is great and all, but this video isn't a dig race, its a roll race. Launch control doesn't matter. And the all mighty dct is less of an advantage in roll racing vs 1/4 racing.
        The DCT is going to have some impact, especially because this is a centri supercharged car where boost increases with RPMs. Because the DCT gearing is shorter, it's going to put the RPMs post shift a little higher (vs. a 6MT), thus keeping boost up & near the peak power in each gear.

        An HPF Stage 2 makes somewhere between 518 HP (91 octane) and 731 (110 octane), it will easily make more power on E85 like you mentioned but this specific video is showcasing an unknown octane + meth. The AA Stage 3 is producing 700 HP, and while the E92 is heavier, the DCT's superior gearing gives it the 1-3 car edge.


        Still not so sure what's difficult to believe about this Click here to enlarge We're looking at this specific comparison, but without a doubt there are several E46 M3s that are much faster than the fastest E9x M3s (whether that's Drew's/Izzy's VT3 or the Gintani YSI cars)
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        but without a doubt there are several E46 M3s that are much faster than the fastest E9x M3s (whether that's Drew's/Izzy's VT3 or the Gintani YSI cars)
        The VT3's are weak I wouldn't even bother talking about them when discussing built motor applications. Non-factor.

        We'll have to see on how the YSI stacks up to the big boys.
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        We'll have to see on how the YSI stacks up to the big boys.
        Click here to enlarge Since I assume the shop M3 that used to have the YSI (the one tightie ran in the video) is now being used for the Gintani TT testing, do you know if there are any YSI equipped (customer) cars running around?
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        Click here to enlarge Since I assume the shop M3 that used to have the YSI (the one tightie ran in the video) is now being used for the Gintani TT testing, do you know if there are any YSI equipped (customer) cars running around?
        I don't know of anybody.
      1. SexiPYm3's Avatar
        SexiPYm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        Still not so sure what's difficult to believe about this Click here to enlarge We're looking at this specific comparison
        I am only stating that the video isn't the best... If the E46 does indeed have more power, it should not lose as long as the race goes the distance. They are in gears longer at higher speeds where the hpf car should walk away. For all we know, the hpf could have had major traction issues. But it is what it is. There are other factors that matter when these cars are making big power.
      1. SexiPYm3's Avatar
        SexiPYm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        without a doubt there are several E46 M3s that are much faster than the fastest E9x M3s (whether that's Drew's/Izzy's VT3 or the Gintani YSI cars)
        You sir are correct. Sticky doesn't think so. But if his car is ever ready, there's a guy that Sticky previously called out and trash talked, that makes 800+ whp in his e46 m3 and he has a buddy that also makes 800+ whp.... Their cars are dialed in correctly and don't have many traction issues.... They would easily walk away from the fastest supercharged E9x M3, if that is indeed Sticky.
      1. SexiPYm3's Avatar
        SexiPYm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge

        Regardless, what are the specs on your E46?
        I have a "stock motor" e46 M3!
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SexiPYm3 Click here to enlarge
        You sir are correct. Sticky doesn't think so. But if his car is ever ready, there's a guy that Sticky previously called out and trash talked, that makes 800+ whp in his e46 m3 and he has a buddy that also makes 800+ whp.... Their cars are dialed in correctly and don't have many traction issues.... They would easily walk away from the fastest supercharged E9x M3, if that is indeed Sticky.
        Somebody's gotta get Marcus to come out with his Saad Racing/ProEFI Turbo E46 M3. The most recent dyno video says it's at 834 RWHP/ 629 WTQ at 18psi

      1. SexiPYm3's Avatar
        SexiPYm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        Somebody's gotta get Marcus to come out with his Saad Racing/ProEFI Turbo E46 M3. The most recent dyno video says it's at 834 RWHP/ 629 WTQ at 18psi

        http://youtu.be/gHbN52lZsXk
        Marcus' car can beat on any supercharged e9x m3... And he isn't even the fastest e46. But Sadly, a race with him and @Sticky would probably never happen unless Sticky made his way to a track that Marcus was at.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SexiPYm3 Click here to enlarge
        Marcus' car can beat on any supercharged e9x m3... And he isn't even the fastest e46. But Sadly, a race with him and @Sticky would probably never happen unless Sticky made his way to a track that Marcus was at.
        I'd love to destroy marcus. If it doesn't happen it's not on me. I said I want him.
      1. SexiPYm3's Avatar
        SexiPYm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I'd love to destroy marcus. If it doesn't happen it's not on me. I said I want him.
        You wanting to destroy his car, and then actually being able to are 2 completely different things. Its funny to me because this will never happen. After the past, the only way you're getting a race with him or a few other higher HP E46 M3s, is if you show up to where they are. You sure seem confident for someone who doesn't even have a properly running car.
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SexiPYm3 Click here to enlarge
        Marcus' car can beat on any supercharged e9x m3...
        Reason why I specifically mentioned his was A) it's very well known B) because he's running the ProEFI (vs. a AEM piggy), there's no "traction" related excuses
      1. SexiPYm3's Avatar
        SexiPYm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        Reason why I specifically mentioned his was A) it's very well known B) because he's running the ProEFI (vs. a AEM piggy), there's no "traction" related excuses
        This is true. There are other turbo e46 cars that don't have traction issues. I may soon be amongst those individuals. That will just add one more e46 m3 to the list that can beat Sticky and all other supercharged e9x cars. lol
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SexiPYm3 Click here to enlarge
        You wanting to destroy his car, and then actually being able to are 2 completely different things. Its funny to me because this will never happen. After the past, the only way you're getting a race with him or a few other higher HP E46 M3s, is if you show up to where they are. You sure seem confident for someone who doesn't even have a properly running car.
        I should be confident as I have a better understanding of the two platforms and how they compare I believe. I'll come to them if I have to. One way or another the comparison between these motors will happen and for years to come. It's all in good fun or it should be.

        There are a good number of turbo E46's to choose from.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SexiPYm3 Click here to enlarge
        This is true. There are other turbo e46 cars that don't have traction issues. I may soon be amongst those individuals. That will just add one more e46 m3 to the list that can beat Sticky and all other supercharged e9x cars. lol
        Well hey then we can run! Just have to figure out the logistics.