• Supercharged E92 M3 showdown - ESS VT2-625 DCT M3 versus VF-Engineering VF620 6-speed manual M3

      Here is a race video between two supercharged E9X M3's running competing kits. One is a DCT (dual clutch transmission) M3 and that is the camera car with the ESS VT2-625 kit. The manual M3 has the VF-Engineering VF620 supercharger kit. This is a very evenly matched race as to be expected from two kits offering very similar performance. The manual has a slight jump and the DCT appears to reel it in somewhat although the race simply ends up basically a draw.


      A very nice run but it would be great to see more than one race between these two. Regardless, it goes to show kits on the stock internals will basically end up in the same spot with fuel, boost, timing, etc., being the main differences especially among similar Vortech based superchargers. Despite what certain companies may say, the kits are very close to one another.

      Camera car with DCT and ESS VT2-625 kit has a 91/100 mix. The VF car is also said to be a 91/100 mix.

      This article was originally published in forum thread: ESS 625 DCT E92 M3 VS VF620 6MT E92 M3 started by LostMarine View original post
      Comments 44 Comments
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by heavytiresmoke Click here to enlarge
        Looks to me the VF did better off with the negatives against him.
        I would agree.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        considering DCT is supposedly worth "10mph", he was on small rear tires, AND had his extra wheels/tires and tools in the trunk, yea. I think he did rather well
        It isn't worth 10 mph from a roll versus a manual. It's never worth 10 mph.
      1. Legionofboom's Avatar
        Legionofboom -
        Looks like the white car was actually faster, but he missed a shift and started a gear higher. (just what it looked like to me)
      1. LostMarine's Avatar
        LostMarine -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90SoFlo Click here to enlarge
        Looks like the white car was actually faster, but he missed a shift and started a gear higher. (just what it looked like to me)
        the Manual car is also carrying an extra 200 or so pounds. looks like it was shifted decently though. Like ive always said, DCT's only REAL advantage is consistancy. so what you are seeing is the REALWORLD result of .1-.2 seconds and maybe 1-2 mph difference(because of that .1-.2 TOTAL shift time) between transmissions
      1. DubSport's Avatar
        DubSport -
        Who needs DCT when you can shift as quick as that guy! Way to go 6MT driver!
      1. Andrew@activeautowerke's Avatar
        Andrew@activeautowerke -
        The outcome I would expect when the same blower is used on both kits.
      1. inlineS54B32's Avatar
        inlineS54B32 -
        I think the shift time for DCT is 0ms - it's single clutch (SMG) that has a delay/there is a traction loss. I can dig up the quote from the Getrag engineer - it's on the board somewhere; I was curious, so I emailed him. There is no tractive loss between shifts, in other words no delay. On a manual car, it has to be greater than 0ms, it just depends on the driver.
      1. inlineS54B32's Avatar
        inlineS54B32 -
        Regardless, definitely looks like VF kit has a more accurate power rating considering it kept up with a "faster" car.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Andrew@activeautowerke Click here to enlarge
        The outcome I would expect when the same blower is used on both kits.
        Exactly.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by inlineS54B32 Click here to enlarge
        I think the shift time for DCT is 0ms - it's single clutch (SMG) that has a delay/there is a traction loss. I can dig up the quote from the Getrag engineer - it's on the board somewhere; I was curious, so I emailed him. There is no tractive loss between shifts, in other words no delay. On a manual car, it has to be greater than 0ms, it just depends on the driver.
        DCT is not 0 but it is almost instant.
      1. Andrew@activeautowerke's Avatar
        Andrew@activeautowerke -
        It comes down to manifold design,boost and tune. I would guess the intercooler systems are almost identical.


        7 speed vs 6
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Andrew@activeautowerke Click here to enlarge
        It comes down to manifold design,boost and tune. I would guess the intercooler systems are almost identical.
        Exactly, these kits are incredibly similar.
      1. nafoo's Avatar
        nafoo -
        This looks like two cars with the same power and different gearing.

        White M3 looks like he hit the rev limiter right before the finish, which gave the Blue M3 the win.

        If both cars were at the same weight and had a better start, it would be a battle of gearing!
      1. LostMarine's Avatar
        LostMarine -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by nafoo Click here to enlarge
        This looks like two cars with the same power and different gearing.

        White M3 looks like he hit the rev limiter right before the finish, which gave the Blue M3 the win.

        If both cars were at the same weight and had a better start, it would be a battle of gearing!
        NOOOO!! Not possible!! nothing is close, something MUST BE WRONG!!
      1. nafoo's Avatar
        nafoo -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        NOOOO!! Not possible!! nothing is close, something MUST BE WRONG!!
        But, it'll only take one mistake on the 6MT's part and the DCT will eat him alive :p
      1. 0-60Motorsports's Avatar
        0-60Motorsports -
        Nice race.
      1. longboarder's Avatar
        longboarder -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        the Manual car is also carrying an extra 200 or so pounds. looks like it was shifted decently though. Like ive always said, DCT's only REAL advantage is consistancy. so what you are seeing is the REALWORLD result of .1-.2 seconds and maybe 1-2 mph difference(because of that .1-.2 TOTAL shift time) between transmissions
        Wrong. The blue car had wheels and a couple tools...less than 100 lbs. in the trunk.

        In the first vid, I started in 3rd gear at 40 mph and the blue M3 started in 2nd gear. I also hit the rev limiter as I was pulling just before the finish line.

        Did you guys not see the second race? We both started in 2nd gear and I put 5 cars on it.

        The blue M3 dyno'd at 580 wheel on 91 octane and 603 wheel with some MS 109.

        Figures that LM would try to distort the record.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by longboarder Click here to enlarge
        Did you guys not see the second race? We both started in 2nd gear and I put 5 cars on it.
        Was this one posted? Not sure.
      1. longboarder's Avatar
        longboarder -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Was this one posted? Not sure.
        The two races were combined by me into one video. LM must have edited out the second race.

        Someone who was actually at the event alerted me to this thread and the complete BS that was being spewed by LM.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by longboarder Click here to enlarge
        The two races were combined by me into one video. LM must have edited out the second race.
        Well then that is definitely unfair if true. Please post your second race.