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  • APR Stage 3+ 2.0 TSI MKVI Golf cracks 400 whp on 93 octane pump

    This is some very, very nice power available for the 2.0 TSI motors as shown in this MKVI Golf. 405.6 horsepower at the wheels on 93 octane pump gas certainly is impressive. Especially when put in context of the stock horsepower numbers which are 200.4 at the wheels. The factory horsepower was more than doubled by the APR Stage III+ kit. Dyno courtesy of AP Tuning.


    This article was originally published in forum thread: APR Stage 3+ 2.0 TSI MKVI Golf cracks 400 whp on 93 octane pump started by Sticky View original post
    Comments 21 Comments
    1. fastgti69's Avatar
      fastgti69 -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mazdaspeed6 Click here to enlarge
      saw this on facebook.... gotta love tsi
      Hell yea man, I love that motor.
    1. DBFIU's Avatar
      DBFIU -
      One the best motors ever made. My wifes passat has that motor and its powerful even in stock form.
    1. jspirate's Avatar
      jspirate -
      No one is taking my K04'd TSI from me. They will have to kill me first!

      Attachment 17367

      Attachment 17368
    1. DBFIU's Avatar
      DBFIU -
      wow did you upgrade the turbo on the CC?
    1. jspirate's Avatar
      jspirate -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
      wow did you upgrade the turbo on the CC?
      Yeah. The k03 is the stock turbo, and a couple of the tuners sell the S3/Golf R OEM k04 turbo and tune as an upgrade package. Dollar per dollar its one of the better torq/HP upgrades you can get on a four banger. I payed $2400 for the new kit and tune. Well, I also got an intercooler, downpipe and intake. So, my total price was more than that, but still a decent deal.
    1. DBFIU's Avatar
      DBFIU -
      Not bad, do you have the DSG transmission? How is it holding up? What power is it putting down?
    1. jspirate's Avatar
      jspirate -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
      Not bad, do you have the DSG transmission? How is it holding up? What power is it putting down?
      6MT. I am old school and will pick the straight drive every time, even if its slower than the auto. I just like doing the gears and 3rd pedal.

      Not sure on the power. I tried to dyno it once at a mooo-stang shop and they never could get a good tach reading.

      APR claims 366HP and 380TQ with the 93 octane file (at crank). I have 93 and 100 files. I don't have a cat-back exhaust due to the sound it makes, but I understand that the CC OEM cat-back is fairly free flowing. APR estimates 10% drivetrain loss and VW has it at 16%. So the cat-back and conservative 10% drivetrain loss are close to being a wash.

      The transmission is solid, but the clutch is starting to show some signs of slippage. I think I have a few more months on it though.

      1st gear is a traction control joke
      2nd can be controlled with the throttle about 50% of the time - it takes a damn near perfect execution to keep the power going to the ground without breaking the tires loose
      3rd and 4th are really fun

      The low end torq is what makes it so fun. You barely hear the engine making any noise and the butt dyno makes you go "OH!!" Then the engine sound cranks up a bit and it pulls hard all the way through 6500 rpm.


      Attachment 17369
    1. Sticky's Avatar
      Sticky -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jspirate Click here to enlarge
      No one is taking my K04'd TSI from me. They will have to kill me first!

      Attachment 17367

      Attachment 17368
      Did that come with the K04 stock?
    1. Sticky's Avatar
      Sticky -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jspirate Click here to enlarge
      Yeah. The k03 is the stock turbo, and a couple of the tuners sell the S3/Golf R OEM k04 turbo and tune as an upgrade package. Dollar per dollar its one of the better torq/HP upgrades you can get on a four banger. I payed $2400 for the new kit and tune. Well, I also got an intercooler, downpipe and intake. So, my total price was more than that, but still a decent deal.
      There is the answer.

      Really cool, did you create a thread on this car? If not, you should.
    1. fastgti69's Avatar
      fastgti69 -
      Badass! k04 CC 6spedd too!It must haul ass and is surely a sleeper lol. Nobody would understand. Good price on the kit too, with all the extra stuff on top.

      DSG is able to handle about 400wtq btw. One of the guys had an audi S3 and went with the BSH turbokit with a 3076 with a built motor. Hit over 500whp and I'm sure the torque was near 400 at least too. Stock DSG and everything, I know there was a tune for it or something.
    1. Sticky's Avatar
      Sticky -
      The cc is rwd right?
    1. fastgti69's Avatar
      fastgti69 -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
      The cc is rwd right?
      Ha, no FWD.
    1. Sticky's Avatar
      Sticky -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by fastgti69 Click here to enlarge
      Ha, no FWD.
      Damn VW... no optional AWD?
    1. fastgti69's Avatar
      fastgti69 -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
      Damn VW... no optional AWD?
      Nah, not with this car. It's all about the GTI with the TSI motor. Not even the Golf R with AWD is that good of an engine cause its old school FSI that they had in europe in the audi s3 etc. I heard APR was doing an AWD kit for the GTI because the TSI was such a better motor. They were doing something with hadlex differential/trannys. I have no clue. This VW scene is a abig mess lol.
    1. BoostAddict's Avatar
      BoostAddict -
      What makes the TSI better? The only thing that I remember reading was it has a timing chain vs belt, and a different hpfp. That was years ago that I looked into it though.
    1. Sticky's Avatar
      Sticky -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BoostAddict Click here to enlarge
      What makes the TSI better? The only thing that I remember reading was it has a timing chain vs belt, and a different hpfp. That was years ago that I looked into it though.
      Would like to know this as well.

      I still don't have a grasp on these damn VW motors.
    1. fastgti69's Avatar
      fastgti69 -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BoostAddict Click here to enlarge
      What makes the TSI better? The only thing that I remember reading was it has a timing chain vs belt, and a different hpfp. That was years ago that I looked into it though.
      That is the main reasons, along with injectors are different. Much stronger rods than the FSI. Much better with airflow.

      Ahh here it is. quote from Arin@APR himself:

      Quote:
      Originally Posted by Arin@APR Click here to enlarge

      The FSI head does not flow as well as the TSI.
      The FSI is more susceptible to knock than the TSI.
      The FSI does not have as good of a fueling system as the TSI.
      The FSI has more internal losses compared to the TSI.

      The TSI is just better so it makes more power. We should expect that form a completely new engine from VW. That's how progress works. That's all.
    1. fastgti69's Avatar
      fastgti69 -
      Should make a new thread for this but..

      TSI motor (regardless of CBFA or CCTA):
      Displacement: 121 cu in (1984 cm3)
      Maximum Power: 200 hp (147 kW) at 5100 - 6000 rpm
      Maximum Torque: 206 lb ft (280 Nm) at 1700 - 5000 rpm
      Number of Valves Per Cylinder: 4
      Bore: 3.2 in (82.5 mm) & Stroke: 3.7 in (92.8 mm)
      Compression Ratio: 9.6 : 1
      Firing Order: 1-3-4-2
      Engine Weight: 317 lb (144 kg)
      Engine Management: Bosch MED 17.5
      Fuel Grade: 95/91 RON
      Exhaust Emission Standard: ULEV (CCTA) - SULEV (CBFA)
      Some major differences from the FSI to TSI include:
      -- chain timing vs belt as seen in the FSI
      -- different fuel/engine management system
      -- components in the intake system (as defined above)
      -- oil filter and oil dipstick relocated
      -- improved PCV system (proved to be problematic in the FSI)
      -- compression ratio lowered to 9.6:1
      -- more balanced cam shafts in the center of the block on both sides
      -- down pipe
      -- better emissions (by U.S. standards and regulation)
      -- more 02 sensors on exhaust system
      originally posted by Arin@APR

      There are several hardware differences between the different versions. The main changes between the US versions is simply Emissions. US vs ROW also has emissions changes and some other hardware changes for more "headroom" for the higher output "b" version.
      CCTA = US Hardware - 200 HP
      CBFA = US Hardware, High Emissions - 200 HP
      CCZA = ROW Hardware, 200 HP
      CCZB = ROW Hardware, 210 HP

      US MK5/MK6 2.0 TSI Engine
      CCTA
      CBFA
      CCT and CBF denote the engine's mechanical structure. IE, secondary injection (CBF) vs non secondary injection (CCT). A, the 4th letter, denotes the power output for the calibration, ie both rated in the us for 207ft-lb/200hp.

      ROW MK6 and A3 2.0 TSI Engines
      CCZA - A3
      CCZB - MK6CCZ denotes the european mechanical structure. A denotes the 200HP calibration. B denotes the 210HP calibration.


      originally posted by xgtiride

      ...The fuel system is now run off of a new lobe of its own to reduce wear, which was a problem with some of the earlier 2.0t engines (from the tech's mouth). It is now also run off of the exhaust cam and no longer the intake cam. The tech noted that the injectors must overcome the combustion pressure of the engine to even force fuel directly, causing them to have operation pressures upwards of 1400 psi.....the intake runners have a plate splitting them into two pathways. In the intake manifold exists individual butterfly valve like air flow splitters that direct the airflow into only half of the intake runners while cruising or coasting, thus increasing gas mileage. The airflow is directed into both paths when the engine is under load to increase air flow and power. Other notes: The intake is not part of the engine cover, and the sound pipe can easily be removed...
    1. Sticky's Avatar
      Sticky -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by fastgti69 Click here to enlarge
      Should make a new thread for this but..

      TSI motor (regardless of CBFA or CCTA):
      Displacement: 121 cu in (1984 cm3)
      Maximum Power: 200 hp (147 kW) at 5100 - 6000 rpm
      Maximum Torque: 206 lb ft (280 Nm) at 1700 - 5000 rpm
      Number of Valves Per Cylinder: 4
      Bore: 3.2 in (82.5 mm) & Stroke: 3.7 in (92.8 mm)
      Compression Ratio: 9.6 : 1
      Firing Order: 1-3-4-2
      Engine Weight: 317 lb (144 kg)
      Engine Management: Bosch MED 17.5
      Fuel Grade: 95/91 RON
      Exhaust Emission Standard: ULEV (CCTA) - SULEV (CBFA)
      Some major differences from the FSI to TSI include:
      -- chain timing vs belt as seen in the FSI
      -- different fuel/engine management system
      -- components in the intake system (as defined above)
      -- oil filter and oil dipstick relocated
      -- improved PCV system (proved to be problematic in the FSI)
      -- compression ratio lowered to 9.6:1
      -- more balanced cam shafts in the center of the block on both sides
      -- down pipe
      -- better emissions (by U.S. standards and regulation)
      -- more 02 sensors on exhaust system
      originally posted by Arin@APR

      There are several hardware differences between the different versions. The main changes between the US versions is simply Emissions. US vs ROW also has emissions changes and some other hardware changes for more "headroom" for the higher output "b" version.
      CCTA = US Hardware - 200 HP
      CBFA = US Hardware, High Emissions - 200 HP
      CCZA = ROW Hardware, 200 HP
      CCZB = ROW Hardware, 210 HP

      US MK5/MK6 2.0 TSI Engine
      CCTA
      CBFA
      CCT and CBF denote the engine's mechanical structure. IE, secondary injection (CBF) vs non secondary injection (CCT). A, the 4th letter, denotes the power output for the calibration, ie both rated in the us for 207ft-lb/200hp.

      ROW MK6 and A3 2.0 TSI Engines
      CCZA - A3
      CCZB - MK6CCZ denotes the european mechanical structure. A denotes the 200HP calibration. B denotes the 210HP calibration.


      originally posted by xgtiride

      ...The fuel system is now run off of a new lobe of its own to reduce wear, which was a problem with some of the earlier 2.0t engines (from the tech's mouth). It is now also run off of the exhaust cam and no longer the intake cam. The tech noted that the injectors must overcome the combustion pressure of the engine to even force fuel directly, causing them to have operation pressures upwards of 1400 psi.....the intake runners have a plate splitting them into two pathways. In the intake manifold exists individual butterfly valve like air flow splitters that direct the airflow into only half of the intake runners while cruising or coasting, thus increasing gas mileage. The airflow is directed into both paths when the engine is under load to increase air flow and power. Other notes: The intake is not part of the engine cover, and the sound pipe can easily be removed...
      Yes... you really should along with including the post above t.
    1. jspirate's Avatar
      jspirate -
      Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
      Damn VW... no optional AWD?
      Not on the 2.0 TSI, only the V6 and that engine is no fun. Its also not a very reasonable price point (the all wheel drive). I got lucky and picked up my 2011 right when they released the 2012s. I picked it up for just over 24 grand. I was actually in the market for a rear wheel drive car, but when I did the modding math, I couldn't pass on the deal.