• Weistec Engineering now offering Stage I Naturally Aspirated M156/63 AMG tune - +47 wheel horsepower on 91 octane, $990

      We thought this eventually might come but not so soon. Weistec has decided to sell a naturally aspirated tune for the M156 V8 which offers gains of 47 wheel horsepower on 91 octane, impressive. In addition to the horsepower gain torque is upped by 32 wheel, the speed limiter is removed, and the throttle response is optimized. The price is a very reasonable $990 which also is credited toward a supercharger purchase should one decide they want more power.




      Key Features:

      • +47 Wheel Horsepower
      • +32 Wheel Torque
      • Eliminate Top Speed Limiter
      • Increased Throttle Response
      • Optimized Fuel and Spark
      • Credit towards Stage 1/1+ Supercharger Systems


      To order: http://weistec.com/m156nas1.html
      This article was originally published in forum thread: Weistec Engineering now offering Stage I Naturally Aspirated M156/63 AMG tune - +47 wheel horsepower on 91 octane, $990 started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 400 Comments
      1. Dodger63's Avatar
        Dodger63 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
        Fixed it for ya.
        that's a bit of an assumtion but if it makes you feel good thats fine, techtek is like the mhp exgirlfriend
      1. LZH's Avatar
        LZH -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Dodger63 Click here to enlarge
        that's a bit of an assumtion but if it makes you feel good thats fine, techtek is like the mhp exgirlfriend
        You're right....it IS an assumption. Would you like to clarify for us all who MHP is using for their tunes now ?
      1. Dodger63's Avatar
        Dodger63 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
        You're right....it IS an assumption. Would you like to clarify for us all who MHP is using for their tunes now ?
        If I new id tell you but I'm not sure exactly how that has something to do with how the egg is faster
      1. LZH's Avatar
        LZH -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Dodger63 Click here to enlarge
        If I new id tell you but I'm not sure exactly how that has something to do with how the egg is faster
        I understand. I just want to know which tuner MHP is now reselling or if they have gone back to tuning in-house. You seem like a very hands on type of guy, I'm surprised you haven't asked.
      1. Dodger63's Avatar
        Dodger63 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
        I understand. I just want to know which tuner MHP is now reselling or if they have gone back to tuning in-house. You seem like a very hands on type of guy, I'm surprised you haven't asked.
        I'm very hands on, I understand thar many of you guys dislike many things about Andy and his actions, he's always and I mean always delivered for me, he said he got a new tuning partner and to send my ecu to him that he has a new tune that will be as good if not better. So far it seems on par with the old tune I'm resending it back as we speak for some more tweaks. Maybe I should or maybe I shouldn't but I trust him,, please dont beat me up
      1. LZH's Avatar
        LZH -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Dodger63 Click here to enlarge
        I'm very hands on, I understand thar many of you guys dislike many things about Andy and his actions, he's always and I mean always delivered for me, he said he got a new tuning partner and to send my ecu to him that he has a new tune that will be as good if not better. So far it seems on par with the old tune I'm resending it back as we speak for some more tweaks. Maybe I should or maybe I shouldn't but I trust him,, please dont beat me up
        Hey that's cool man, I'm glad the relationship is working out for you.
        As I said, I just want to know whose tune MHP is using now, that's all. I don't have the time or energy to engage in any further MHP bashing - it's run it's course and I'm over it.
      1. Dodger63's Avatar
        Dodger63 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
        Hey that's cool man, I'm glad the relationship is working out for you.
        As I said, I just want to know whose tune MHP is using now, that's all. I don't have the time or energy to engage in any further MHP bashing - it's run it's course and I'm over it.
        That's good news, go get that weistec tune now,
      1. JRCART's Avatar
        JRCART -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
        I understand. I just want to know which tuner MHP is now reselling or if they have gone back to tuning in-house. You seem like a very hands on type of guy, I'm surprised you haven't asked.
        back to tuning in-house??? When did MHP do in-house tuning? When Andy and MHP first came to MBW I was the first guy to purchase an MHP tune and it was done by Dave Casper in a suburb of Detroit, I still have the paperwork and the adress I shipped it to. Then Kasper told him to pound sand and he found another out sourced tuner, then he went to eurotek/techtek.
      1. JRCART's Avatar
        JRCART -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Dodger63 Click here to enlarge
        I'm very hands on, I understand thar many of you guys dislike many things about Andy and his actions, he's always and I mean always delivered for me, he said he got a new tuning partner and to send my ecu to him that he has a new tune that will be as good if not better. So far it seems on par with the old tune I'm resending it back as we speak for some more tweaks. Maybe I should or maybe I shouldn't but I trust him,, please dont beat me up
        Listen Mike, I know you and I have had our issues but I think we respect each other now (I respect you anyways) but please don't try to insult my inteligence. I've been building and racing motorcycles and then cars since I was 9 years old. I've been around the block dozens of times and met all kinds of "tuners" some legit and some scam artist con men. I can tell that you've been around the block a few times yourself so I'm not going to talk down to you like you're some noob but let me ask you one simple question. This "new and improved" MHP tune that you're running, how did Andy get it so quickly? A new tuner would have to spend time tuning a 63 on a dyno...lots of time actually...that is unless its a pirated tune. You have a fast ass car, why would you be so eager to put some boxed tune on your record holding car? You run straight exhaust, no cats and no mufflers, right? That aspect of your car alone should require a custom tune, not a boxed generic tune. So I will now ask you, had any of these questions I just asked crossed your mind? If not I would be suprised and if not maybe you have not been around the block as many times as I thought and you definately don't take a "hands on approach" like you stated that you do because those are all basic and common sense good questions you should have asked Andy before sending him the ECU out of your record holding C63.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by propain Click here to enlarge
        Glad to see someone else in a futile and annoy debate with Joe. Is that what it looks like? Sheeshh.. When I said talking to a wall I think I was being nice. Its more like... Click here to enlarge

        Moe, you know Joe. Admit he is right or just let it go. No point otherwise. I believe you and I are on the same page.

        Joe, I understand where you are coming from (This is where you lack the ability to debate Joe, to admit something like that) But not in all cases will 10 whp be enough to show any type of gain on the track. The forces pushing against the vehicle at greater speeds might require more to do anything at all. Your point is even if its .00001 its doing something. Sure, if you want to break out a microscope to win this debate... You win! LOL.

        Were talking about real track results here though not a science lab. Not in all cases will you see a gain on the track in MPH by adding 10 whp. It all depends on the variables. At stock levels that gain shouldnt be so hard to see. An extensively modified vehicle however and it wont be that easy to detect if at all.

        Now back to a debate with some reality... The baseline E63 dyno was low compared to its advertised crank HP. 24% loss through the drive train is simply crazy. So either the machine reads low. Or the baseline was low. 447 rwhp doesnt tell me the machine reads low. Drop in filters or not.
        I did not realize we were on a first name basis?

        There is no debate, it's simple physics regarding added horsepower. Horses do not pick and choose when to show up and they don't take time off. There are also no invisible horses that don't do anything. Arguing against this is simply ridiculous. Your example was a suspension malfunction for why a time did not improve, do I really need to say anything further?

        I have had no problem ever detecting additional horsepower in my car. Yours must be some kind of special vehicle working outside the laws of physics.

        It's reading 441 whp NOT 447. Come on man, at least get the numbers right.

        The baseline E63 dyno was not low, you have nothing to base this on and are not familiar with that particular dyno or other vehicles that have dyno'd on it. I provided a dyno reading lower on a different dynojet, why is this ignored? WHP will vary from dyno to dyno and change with different correction factors. Why is this still not sinking in? Why are you treating a measurement as an absolute when the math calculating it can change significantly based on how it is being calculated (SAE, DIN, etc.)? So if a car dyno's low 300's on a dyno dynamics the drivetrain loss increased all of a sudden? No. DRIVETRAIN LOSS FROM CRANK BASED ON HAND PICKED % FIGURES IS IRRELEVANT. PERIOD. You missed the whole drivetrain debate, a little late. You simply don't even know what you are trying to talk about it and your math isn't even correct as your numbers are off. I realize you want to participate but you may want to go back and read what I already wrote.

        I'd love to engage a debate with you but you need to get the basics right first, ok?
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JonsC63AMG Click here to enlarge
        Bottom line is TUNE ONLY is TUNE ONLY end of story.
        Yep, and some people really missed this big time.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Exeenom Click here to enlarge
        The relevance is to the platform since it shows there is no magic being done to accomplish something no one else can.
        Are you familiar at all with what was modified in this tune vs. what other tuners are doing? Your entire body of knowledge that has been applied has been with results on other dynojets with other tuners. Have you even bothered to look into what they might be doing differently?

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Exeenom Click here to enlarge
        Bro... I meant and re-stated a couple of times that I was surprised you didn't mention it earlier (as in your first or second post) in direct response to my first post since that was the point I hammered initially. It's okay, you must've missed it for the first 2.5 hours and a few posts then came back to it. It's no biggie... you didn't have to.
        Sorry bud, this is what you stated and you are now backtracking. No harm in simply admitting you were wrong:

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Exeenom Click here to enlarge
        The funny part is that for some reason you never said anything
        That is pretty clear isn't it? The funny part is that I never said anything? Yet I did on page 2 page 28 and you missed it and you missed the graph in the very first post? Not a big deal to simply say oops I made a mistake. I believe you kind of owe me an apology there for making that accusation in the first place when you are at fault. How can you try to blame me for your mistake?

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Exeenom Click here to enlarge
        Agree to disagree I guess. In my opinion, dyno graphs are great tool to show difference in power between the mods but not best for detailing package specs. They may work okay, but just not the best way. Did you ever get a chance to get a bit more details about the tuning package? What air filters they use, etc.... I think RENNtech used AFE and Evosport used BMC.
        I have no idea what air filters were used but I really doubt there is any kind of significant difference between aftermarket filters available. BMC and AFE filters are both going to be better than the stock filters which I would assume have a charcoal element in them which is really the main point of restriction.

        Why is a graph not good for detailing specs exactly when you can write text on the graph to show what changes were made between pulls? What more is necessary? A giant billboard of some sort with neon lights? It's all there.

        Mo, you missed the info. You also missed the subsequent post in addition on page 2. You operated under the assumption this was tune only. I realize in retrospect you may want to blame me for not spelling everything out for you as if that would alleviate your mistake but these are solely your own mistakes. Not a big deal, I'm glad it is all clear now and people can see there is nothing crazy about the gains.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Exeenom Click here to enlarge
        You have to remember.... we didn't say that there will be no gains to the engine.... we just said the gains may sometimes not show on the track as expected. And we didn't even say for all cars and all speeds, we just said that it is definitely possible and has happened in the past. The speed traps at the 1/4 mile track will definitely not show a 0.00001 difference. Heck even their 0.001 is within their error margin. So it is indeed possible to have gains on the dyno not show on the track, and it gets progressively worse for larger and heavier cars. I think (or hope) we're all on the same page on this one.
        I'm going to make this crystal clear. It is a physical impossibility assuming equal conditions, launch, weight, fuel, etc., that additional horsepower will not show. It simply has to. There are examples of hot weather sucking power but you are essentially inventing scenarios where an HP gain may not show. See the part about assuming equal conditions that I wrote and you will see a track works just like a dyno. It's a simple equation really, there is no way around this.

        Any physics major or engineer will straight tell you this, don't take my word for it. You guys really are attempting to fight for a lost cause.
      1. propain's Avatar
        propain -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I did not realize we were on a first name basis?

        Sorry, I can think of some others names for you if you like? Are you offended by me calling you Joe? LOL

        There is no debate, it's simple physics regarding added horsepower. Horses do not pick and choose when to show up and they don't take time off. There are also no invisible horses that don't do anything. Arguing against this is simply ridiculous. Your example was a suspension malfunction for why a time did not improve, do I really need to say anything further?

        Yes, you can address the actual comment about using a microscope to pickup the adding HP at the track and actual track results. To me 10 whp adding .001 MPH at the track did nothing as far as track gains go. Sure, if you want to have a discussion with a few scientist you gained something im sure.

        I have had no problem ever detecting additional horsepower in my car. Yours must be some kind of special vehicle working outside the laws of physics.

        What car is that again? The one you dont drive and lives on the dyno? How would you know? LOL

        It's reading 441 whp NOT 447. Come on man, at least get the numbers right.

        Edit cutoff. I know the number. Cute deflection though.

        The baseline E63 dyno was not low, you have nothing to base this on and are not familiar with that particular dyno or other vehicles that have dyno'd on it. I provided a dyno reading lower on a different dynojet, why is this ignored? WHP will vary from dyno to dyno and change with different correction factors. Why is this still not sinking in? Why are you treating a measurement as an absolute when the math calculating it can change significantly based on how it is being calculated (SAE, DIN, etc.)? So if a car dyno's low 300's on a dyno dynamics the drivetrain loss increased all of a sudden? No. DRIVETRAIN LOSS FROM CRANK BASED ON HAND PICKED % FIGURES IS IRRELEVANT. PERIOD. You missed the whole drivetrain debate, a little late. You simply don't even know what you are trying to talk about it and your math isn't even correct as your numbers are off. I realize you want to participate but you may want to go back and read what I already wrote.

        Not irrelivant at all. Again, you cant have it both ways. Either the baseline was low due to the machine reading low or the 441 would be low as well. Are you saying on another dyno that 441 could show up as 471 whp? You know, the dyno's that read NORMAL. Thats what you are saying. The low number is a low reading because the dyno reads low. Unless you are saying the E63 dynoed was down on power? Crank HP is Crank HP. Drive train loss is completely RELEVANT. You are not getting 24% drive train loss unless something on the dyno is wacked or the vehicle is down on power. Pick one. Then we can debate that. The peak whp is normal. The baseline is not. Explain that.

        I'd love to engage a debate with you but you need to get the basics right first, ok?

        Basics are completely there. You should dont want to see them because they dont help your arguement. Simple Joe tactic.

        ...
      1. propain's Avatar
        propain -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I'm going to make this crystal clear. It is a physical impossibility assuming equal conditions, launch, weight, fuel, etc., that additional horsepower will not show. It simply has to. There are examples of hot weather sucking power but you are essentially inventing scenarios where an HP gain may not show. See the part about assuming equal conditions that I wrote and you will see a track works just like a dyno. It's a simple equation really, there is no way around this.

        Any physics major or engineer will straight tell you this, don't take my word for it. You guys really are attempting to fight for a lost cause.
        Please make this clear for us. Are you talking about actual results that can be detected at the track in the slips or are you talking about micoscopic results a scientist would need to see? If its the latter there is no point in going on.
      1. propain's Avatar
        propain -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Any physics major or engineer will straight tell you this, don't take my word for it. You guys really are attempting to fight for a lost cause.
        You win Joe, you win. Click here to enlarge

        Attachment 12759
      1. c32AMG-DTM's Avatar
        c32AMG-DTM -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I have had no problem ever detecting additional horsepower in my car.
        You must have a well-calibrated butt dyno, then.

        Especially since the sensation of accelleration we experience is primarily derived from torque, not HP... and I don't know about your car, maybe you added gobs of HP all at once, but something like an air filter that might give 10 whp on a 440 whp car (like the one being discussed in this thread)... you're talking about a 2% change in output. You could unequivocally detect such a change, plus or minus?
      1. Dodger63's Avatar
        Dodger63 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JRCART Click here to enlarge
        Listen Mike, I know you and I have had our issues but I think we respect each other now (I respect you anyways) but please don't try to insult my inteligence. I've been building and racing motorcycles and then cars since I was 9 years old. I've been around the block dozens of times and met all kinds of "tuners" some legit and some scam artist con men. I can tell that you've been around the block a few times yourself so I'm not going to talk down to you like you're some noob but let me ask you one simple question. This "new and improved" MHP tune that you're running, how did Andy get it so quickly? A new tuner would have to spend time tuning a 63 on a dyno...lots of time actually...that is unless its a pirated tune. You have a fast ass car, why would you be so eager to put some boxed tune on your record holding car? You run straight exhaust, no cats and no mufflers, right? That aspect of your car alone should require a custom tune, not a boxed generic tune. So I will now ask you, had any of these questions I just asked crossed your mind? If not I would be suprised and if not maybe you have not been around the block as many times as I thought and you definately don't take a "hands on approach" like you stated that you do because those are all basic and common sense good questions you should have asked Andy before sending him the ECU out of your record holding C63.
        To be honest I had many reservations but in the end, the way that eurotec took claim for all the records and what not made me decide I didn't want to do anything else for them, I was contomplating moving to another company, when Andy contacted me and said he had a new tuning partner, I decided to be loyal and "try" it out before moving on,

        Obviously whoever it is has maps got maps or knows some new paramiters in the programming or whatever they do in there, I'm more of a hard parts type of guy,

        In the end what could it really hurt if it worked it worked if not move on,,,,

        As im sure you no records will come and go, Im content with my old run of 10.78 so I chanced it!
      1. cpais's Avatar
        cpais -
        I can't possibly read all these posts but I laugh at a few of them. I have proven, to myself at least, that the butt dyno does not work. I also know that in drag racing, the chassis dyno does not do to much either. When I had my first car I managed to get the car to go a 9.0 with tuning the engine and the suspension and parts to the best of my ability. I then bought an AutoMeter datalogger that datalogged engine, drivetrain and suspension parts. Without adding anything else to the car I was able to save 3/10 of a second in one weekend by making adjustments that I didn't realize needed to be made. The datalogger showed where the car was spinning the tire and where I was losing time. My car would pull nice wheelies and pull hard the whole way so you would never thing that I was losing traction but I was. My butt would have never told me any of that.

        I'm just saying that you guys can argue back and forth about tunes all day, you can argue about DA and what was different between this run and that run but, at the end of the day, we have a lot more development to go into these cars before we realize there true potential. Mike (dodger) is going to go a lot quicker and he will do that because he is motivated to do so. He has a million things going on in his life and has hardly touched his car at all since last year until last week. There are so many small areas of the car that you need to pay attention to and learn about to go faster and, until you pay attention tho that part, the horsepower becomes a secondary issue.

        I am sure that everyone that is going to the drag strip is doing there own little things to the car and eventually, they will all be going fast. It'll be nice when everyone on this forum can be at the same track on the same day. Until then, I am sure that Mike is going to keep trying new things and will probably go faster every time he goes out this winter. I am just glad to have Mike back at the shop working on the car again and it'll be nice to see some new times from him. I am looking forward to hearing when one of you supercharged guys is gonna start making use of your power and start putting some real numbers out there.

        Good luck to everyone.
      1. mainah's Avatar
        mainah -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by cpais Click here to enlarge
        ....There are so many small areas of the car that you need to pay attention to and learn about to go faster and, until you pay attention tho that part, the horsepower becomes a secondary issue....
        Winner.

        The importance of the above statement by cpais cannot be emphasized enough.