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    • Renntech Stage 1 M157 tune in a 2012 CLS63 AMG runs 11.3@125

      Low 11's with just a tune in warm 85 degree Florida weather? That is what a CLS63 AMG (non-Performance Package) with the Stage 1 Renntech M157 tune just did. The Stage I tune raises boost from the stock 14.5 psi to about the exact same amount as the performance package, 18.8 psi. The vehicle was completely stock except for Nitto NT05 drag radials. Density altitude was just under 2000 feet which means in winter conditions we can realistically expect high 10's out of tune only M157 cars.

      This vehicle belonged to a customer so hard launches / launch control were not used as the 1.8 60 foot validates. This just the beginning of M157 performance tuning and things are off to quite a great beginning.




      This article was originally published in forum thread: Renntech Stage 1 M157 tune in a 2012 CLS63 AMG runs 11.3@125 started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 49 Comments
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        This is a quote from your article that you linked:

        "This Renntech tune maintains just about the same maximum boost pressure so the gains seem to be coming from more boost down low as well as adjusting the timing."
        Yep, this is what I was referring to in the post above this one...

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        I'll still stick with my theory that a tune that increases hp by 20 and tq by 40 will not make up the difference of hundreds of pounds.
        Hundred pounds is roughly a tenth as is 10 whp. Guess there is only one way to find out? Point being that the Renntech tune is more aggressive than the factory tune anyway.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        Edit: I read your above post after I posted this post.
        That's fine.
      1. Sonny's Avatar
        Sonny -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        See post number 2 in that thread.

        I mentioned in the OP timing as that was the logical correlation and was told that was not the case. I am simply relaying what I was told.
        I just read the post you're referring to.

        Okay, so here's where I'm coming from. Adjusting limiters doesn't make power, it allows the car to advance the timing and make the boost that is commanded for the programmed settings. Re-scaling the mapping, however, can adjust where the power is made on the power curves.

        But, when I'm making the comparisons that I'm making here, I'm referring to cars that are running under optimal conditions, hence the discussion of heavy sedans running high 10's.

        So, the PP E63 that I'm discussing is firing on all cylinders, so to speak. The stock limiters may not be as aggressive as the RT stage 1 settings, but I still maintain that the PP's power will be sufficient to propell the it, as the lighter car, down the track quicker/faster than the RT stage 1 CLS 63.

        The PP E63's tune also can likely adapt up if it recognizes higher octane. Granted, the power that it can ultimately make will be 20 hp/40 tq less than the RT stage 1 car, but stock limiters on the PP car won't be a hinderance for that car given optimal conditions, so the more aggressive limiters in the RT car will merely allow it to make the 20 hp/ 40 tq extra power, which still shouldn't be enough to compensate for the extra weight.
      1. Sonny's Avatar
        Sonny -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Hundred pounds is roughly a tenth as is 10 whp. Guess there is only one way to find out? Point being that the Renntech tune is more aggressive than the factory tune anyway.
        I'm aware of the 100 lbs/ 10 whp = tenth theory. I tend to think the weight reduction equals more than increase in hp when you're talking about 10 whp increases.

        I'm sorry, but I'll never believe that an increase in 30 whp can net the same gains and dropping 300 lbs. Granted, I have no scientific data to back up my belief. But, it is what it is.

        I'm happy that the RT stage 1 tune is killing it on the track. Should be awesome when we see an E63 with those same power figures.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        I'm aware of the 100 lbs/ 10 whp = tenth theory. I tend to think the weight reduction equals more than increase in hp when you're talking about 10 whp increases.
        I think it is just a rough estimate and an argument can be made either way.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        I'm sorry, but I'll never believe that an increase in 30 whp can net the same gains and dropping 300 lbs. Granted, I have no scientific data to back up my belief. But, it is what it is.
        In trap or ET? Because that depends as well.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        I'm happy that the RT stage 1 tune is killing it on the track. Should be awesome when we see an E63 with those same power figures.
        Looking forward to it. Wish they would drop it in an even lighter car...
      1. Sonny's Avatar
        Sonny -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        In trap or ET? Because that depends as well.



        Looking forward to it. Wish they would drop it in an even lighter car...
        Both trap and ET, IMO.

        Yeah, it would sick if the C63 had the M157. Actually, the SLK would be the most amazing application.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        Both trap and ET, IMO.
        Has an effect on both but I believe weight makes more of a difference in ET than trap while HP does the same but with the emphasis reversed.
      1. Sonny's Avatar
        Sonny -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Has an effect on both but I believe weight makes more of a difference in ET than trap while HP does the same but with the emphasis reversed.
        I hear you.
      1. m54b25's Avatar
        m54b25 -
        Nice times! Road & Track tested a 2012 CLS63 w/Performance package & did 12.0@122.5 on less humidity & colder weather. So now the RT tune alone it's doing almost 0.7 seconds faster in less than favorable conditions, this must be a much faster car in better weather. http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/up...benz-cls63-amg
      1. Sonny's Avatar
        Sonny -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by m54b25 Click here to enlarge
        Nice times! Road & Track tested a 2012 CLS63 w/Performance package & did 12.0@122.5 on less humidity & colder weather. So now the RT tune alone it's doing almost 0.7 seconds faster in less than favorable conditions, this must be a much faster car in better weather. http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/up...benz-cls63-amg
        I don't see any mention in the Road and Track article about the use of DR's so there is a difference in testing methods, and therefore, there wouldn't be a gap of .7 seconds if DR's were used in both tests.
      1. m54b25's Avatar
        m54b25 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        I don't see any mention in the Road and Track article about the use of DR's so there is a difference in testing methods, and therefore, there wouldn't be a gap of .7 seconds if DR's were used in both tests.
        That's definetly a good question Sonny! But, who is driving an almost 4300lbs 2wd sedan 10's sec car on street tires really?
      1. Sonny's Avatar
        Sonny -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by m54b25 Click here to enlarge
        That's definetly a good question Sonny! But, who is driving 10's sec car on street tires really?
        I don't quite know the answer to your question. But, I would wager that the Renntech car wouldn't hit 11.3 ET on street tires.
      1. m54b25's Avatar
        m54b25 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        I don't quite know the answer to your question. But, I would wager that the Renntech car wouldn't hit 11.3 ET on street tires.
        Very true! This would only be a high speed cruiser for the highway =)
      1. Sonny's Avatar
        Sonny -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by m54b25 Click here to enlarge
        That's definetly a good question Sonny! But, who is driving an almost 4300lbs 2wd sedan 10's sec car on street tires really?
        I guess Road and Track did.

        But, I've always wished that auto mags would test these cars with DR's. I agree with you, it's dumb to test the 1/4 mile times with street tires and not DR's.

        Although, I understand that often, the testing is not done on a prepped track; the testing is often done in areas that also have space for skidpad testing, which would necessitate the use of the stock rear tires.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        I don't see any mention in the Road and Track article about the use of DR's so there is a difference in testing methods, and therefore, there wouldn't be a gap of .7 seconds if DR's were used in both tests.
        Trap would still differ and often street tires produce higher traps due to spin...
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        Although, I understand that often, the testing is not done on a prepped track; the testing is often done in areas that also have space for skidpad testing, which would necessitate the use of the stock rear tires.
        Not really true, Insideline uses the Fontana strip when prepped for example. The local SoCal mags do the same thing often, including Road and Track.
      1. M3_WC's Avatar
        M3_WC -
        On top of it, it is one of the best looking cars sold today.

        This car is pure win.
      1. mramg1's Avatar
        mramg1 -
        Now that is laying the smack downClick here to enlargeWay to go RentechClick here to enlargeSo now I have to buy one in two years when they are only 50KClick here to enlarge
      1. Sonny's Avatar
        Sonny -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Trap would still differ and often street tires produce higher traps due to spin...
        Of course trap would still differ if there was a power difference but I was responding to a post that mentioned ET--thus my mention of the effect DR's would have on ET.

        And although spin can help increase trap, it's not a bright line rule, as even in my own very limited drag racing experience, I have seen quicker 60' equate to higher traps than runs with slower 60' due to spin.

        And I get that you didn't state a brightline rule, you said "often."
      1. Sonny's Avatar
        Sonny -
        As I said, I was speaking about ET, because @m54b25 mentioned ET. I don't really understand the relevance of responding with "trap would still differ" other than you just want this to be a pure "Renntech rules" thread. Otherwise, you wouldn't have felt the need to "correct" my conception of comparing two cars that were run in the 1/4 mile; one with DR's one one without.

        Am I wrong?
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sonny Click here to enlarge
        Of course trap would still differ if there was a power difference but I was responding to a post that mentioned ET--thus my mention of the effect DR's would have on ET.

        And although spin can help increase trap, it's not a bright line rule, as even in my own very limited drag racing experience, I have seen quicker 60' equate to higher traps than runs with slower 60' due to spin.

        And I get that you didn't state a brightline rule, you said "often."
        I have consistently seen higher traps with better 60's in my own drag racing experience with my E92 which I might as well call limited as well. With drag radials... street tires spinning produced higher traps on my E46's.

        My point is that street tires are often capable of higher traps due to poor 60 foots inflating them and that a higher trap with a better 60 means it is a far more sound representation. Obviously drag radials are used far more for ET than trap as the goal is the 60 foot.